National Do Not Call List Begins Today

[Kathleen Padgett]

At last, a solution to the annoying and often excessive telemarketing calls we all receive so frequently...

A national do not call registry has been established.

Today is the first day people are eligible to sign up.

Each registration can cover up to 3 phone numbers.

A valid e-mail address is required for confirmation. In order to be effective, users need to open the 2 e-mails they will receive after registration, and use the link to activate their do not call request.

For registrations completed 6/27 through August, calls will cease and complaints may be filed on the do not call website after October 1st.

Additional detailed information is available on the website:

http://www.donotcall.gov/

Individual state do not call registration is available in addition to information on state telemarketing law on the following link:

http://www.governmentguide.com/consumer_services/donotcall.adp

The telephone consumer protection act in addition to guidelines for collecting damages from violators can be found at:

http://www.governmentguide.com/consumer_services/suetelemarketers.adp

[RoseAnn Weingart]

Thanks Kathie, great information! I too am happy to see this stopped. I was on the do not call list for several years and it has been a blessing.
There is also what they call a "Mail Preference Service" registration. It is to reduce the advertising mail you receive at home. It is through the Direct Marketing Association in NY.

Mail Preference Service
Direct Marketing Association
Dept S
P.O. Box 9008
Farmingdale, NY 11735-9008

You become registered on the list for a five year period, at which time you are able to re-register you information again. I found this service invaluable also.

[RoseAnn Weingart]

OOPS.....I just went to their website and some of the information has changed. The website is: www.dmaconsumers.org/offmailinglist.html

You can either fill out the registration form online and pay a $5.00 fee or fill it out and opt to mail it in to the new address of:

Mail Preference Service
ATTN: dept: 10841971
Direct Marketing Association
P.O. Box 282
Carmel, NY 10512

Sorry for the bad information. I will try to research before putting my foot in my mouth again!
Thanks.

[Kathleen Padgett]

Awesome RoseAnn, I like the option to stop unwanted mail also. I get so much junk mail, way too much. Have a great day.

[May K. Toney]

Thank you Kathleen and RoseAnn for the great news and valuable information! Most of our telemarketing calls were weeded out when we obtained Private Messenger through our local phone company. This is an excellent call screening program that forces the caller to identify themselves and provides me the option of accepting or rejecting the call before it's put through. This is alway operating and uses the same screening procedure for anyone trying to leave a voice mail. It's pretty effective but we still received a call or two from telemarketers now and then. Maybe these links will reduce those to zero!

Thanks so much.

[Robert Smith -]

This is great. Now I can get rid of all of these darn phone calls by the telemarketers.

[Byron Burke II]

I had signed up a few weeks ago and it is so great not to have dinner interupted at least 2-3 time a night.

[Michele Maconship]

Thanks, Kathie and RoseAnn, for the great information. I plan to investigate these links and pursue in order to have the telemarketing stopped in my household. There is always so little time in the day to spend with our families, I hate to have it interrupted by unwanted calls.

[Kathleen Padgett]

Originally posted by Michele Kohan
There is always so little time in the day to spend with our families, I hate to have it interrupted by unwanted calls.

So true, so much to do and so little time, especially for family. Adios unwanted phone calls!! So glad to help.

[Michael Harris]

I did mine. I hope it works.

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Michael,

Me too, I guess we'll have to wait to October to find out;) Some woman knocked on my door last night, in the middle of dinner to try to sell me some cleaning items. I hope this will not be the new trend, lol. She kept trying to push the sale, even though I made it clear it wasn't a good time, ugh!

I'll have to install a video camera and voice activated go away response system outside my door if they keep it up, lol:)

[Michael Harris]

Kathie,

I have some gear from X10.com -- check them out.

[Kathleen Padgett]

Michael,

Cool, I will definitely check them out, thanks!

[Michael Harris]

Kathie,

What I really meant was that X10.com has neat toys . :cool:

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Michael,

Gotcha:)

[Ray Montana]

Thanks Kathie and RoseAnn for your help in posting info about the DO NOT CALL LIST and the Mail Preference address.


Now!! What are we going to do with the added hours we will gain as a result of not going to the phone and listening to those many sales and marketing speels??

I guess we can now spent our time deleting our unwanted and unsolicited E-MAILS!!


Thanks again,


Ray Montana
;) :rolleyes:

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Ray,

You're absolutely right about the unwanted e-mails, next huge problem to address:)

[Michael Harris]

Kathie,

I have two AOL accounts, one NetZero account, and three Comcast accounts.

I only use the NetZero to get Internet access on my laptop, so that account only has junk .:eek: :o Unless NetZero sends me some account admin messages. Keeping this on eclean is a breeze.

My AOL account is around because other members of my family are stuck in it. On the two 'screen names, I get from 100 to 150 pieces of email each and every day . Both screen names are easy to keep clean. AOL has some features that help me tremendously.

My primary email is now Comcast. I have three screen names, one for each persona I choose to use.

my primary account for real stuff, the important stuff like IPIU, job hunting, business, etc
one for my 'special friends'
one for junk and speculative responses


I check each one every day. The traffic was light on all until IPIU. I get a message everytime someone posts in a subscribed thread.

I actually read each of these and link into the forum to read the post -- I respond frequently. :) :D :cool:

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Michael,

That's a great way to utilize e-mail accounts and exactly what the experts advise.

[Michael Harris]

Hi Kathie,

When I was working full-time in the defense industry, I would get up to 200 email messages a day. Some of my peers got twice that. :mad:

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Michael,

My word, 200 messages a day? Were you able to find any time to do anything else, other than read or delete e-mails? LOL

[Andre Scott]

This is good news. Its about time..

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Michael,

I know what you mean about those 200 messages per day. When I was employed by a large high tech company, I received over 200 every day and when I got back from vacation, it would take a full day just to read and catch up on happenings, not to mention the e-mails they sent to my personal account and times they called while I was on vacation, geez, felt like I didn't even get the vacation I deserved. No wonder they paid for a nationwide cell phone coverage plan, and a laptop leash, LOL.

I'm looking forward to working independently:) The e-mail volume will be almost as high, but it will be for my own benefit, except for the occasional spam:)

I also noticed nobody is knocking on my office door or interupting me while on the phone, other than my kids, and the cats walk all over my keyboard, while my dog also demands my constant attention: ;)

[Michael Harris]

Hi Kathie,

When I am in my office (in my bedroom), the cat will not even come in.:eek: When I am not in there, the cat may try to sleep on one window sill.:mad:

I clear my email twice a day now trying to stay ahead. But it gets tough.:) :D :cool:

[Colleen L Hayes -]

I like the idea of the 'DO NOT CALL' list also. I worked in a call center as an inbound sales supervisor. As long as they don't try to sell you anything you haven't had or didn't request they can still call.

I just wished there was a way to keep the ones we did utilize, such as home warranties, credit card co., etc, from calling at dinner time. Unfortunately, that is the only time they can catch us at home.

[Jeff Creedon]

I think this do not call thing the the greatest idea since toilet paper. I encourage everyone to sign up I can't stand telemarketers, and yes I agree they need something for email too.

[Michael Harris]

Originally posted by Jeff Creedon
I think this do not call thing the the greatest idea since ...and yes I agree they need something for email too.
Jeff,

The direct marketing folks have three basic approaches.

1 - telemarketing
2 - email
3 - junk snail mail

The telemarketers are a powerfull lobby. They will gut the Do-Not-Call efforts. Bet on it. :(

The email will increase and the spam filters will be blown away. I left my computer for a few hours this afternoon and I logged back on (to one of my half dozen accoutns) and had 92 messages.

Teh snail mail junk will also increase again. And it is subsidized by all of us who buy the $.37 first-class postage.

We are in for a fight. :(

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Colleen,

There is a way to keep the credit card companies you use from calling... it takes them usually about 4-6 weeks to implement, but I learned you can ask them to put you on their own do not call list.

I've had to do that with some agressive companies who assumed that because they were entitled to my personal information, they felt they could call excessively to try to sell me insurance, road service, travel plans and other things I didn't need to add to my credit card bill.

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Michael,

I agree, these companies will fight anything that threatens their income potential. They've already started to battle:( I don't feel they'll be successful in their attempts to justify contacting people who don't want to be bothered though. (I hope not at least).

One of the latest schemes they've implemented is sending text messages and the like to people's cell phones, using the owner's minutes. It's very wrong to force people to pay for the junk they send:(

[Michael Harris]

Good Morning Kathie,

Text messaging would kill me. It costs a little for each message. I bought a text messsaging package on my daughter;s phone, but I have no need of it.

Something else of importanct, I received an email from one of my trade associations indicating that they had to have signed permission for each person and each fax number to send marketing-related materials. Interesting!! :D But not as effective as it could be. I am enclosing the substance of the reply form.


NDIA COMMUNICATIONS MARKETING CONSENT FORM (INDIVIDUAL)

The new Telephone Consumer Protection Act (TCPA) published in the Federal Register, July 25,2003 and effective August 25,2003, requires that NDIA, its Chapters, Divisions, and Affiliates (NTSA, AFEI, PSA, NCWG, and WID), have your express consent for us to send you faxes on membership, subscriptions, event registration, and other material included under the Act. Your completion of the below will enable us to continue to communicate with you in an effective manner.

FAX number or FAX numbers we are authorized to send to _______________________________
Email __________________________
Telephone Number _______________

I understand that by providing my mailing address, Fax Number(s), email address, and telephone number, I consent to receive communications sent by or on behalf of ND IA and its Chapters, Divisions, and Affiliates (NTSA, AFEl, PSA, NCWG, and WID), via regular mail, email, telephone, or fax. I understand that NDIA and its Chapters, Divisions, and Affiliates, may provide my address / email / telephone / fax to other organizations that they have business partner relationships with.

[Colleen L Hayes -]

Hi Michael and Kathleen,

I like that last one Michael. This way if you want the correspondence you give them your e-mail address or fax and that way they pay for it. You don't give your phone number or cell phone number.

The fax machine would use your paper though so there is a little cost there.

If you don't want to deal with them, they get no information. That may almost work.

:D

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Michael,

At least they ask first:D

Hi Colleen,

Very true, I use enough paper from my own printer, no need to receive more unnecessary faxes:D

[Michael Harris]

Kathie,

In one of my business ventures (loan signings), I get about 40% of the loan packages as eDocs. The email me between 1 and 4 files and I print them. The actual cost to me can be as high as half a ream of legal paper and 70% of an ink cartridge - $25-$30! :(

If people start eating up my paper with faxes, I will just send them to my eFax - no paper unless I want to print it off.:)

I have run a few tests - eFax against regular fax. The print quality is too close for me to tell. ;)

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Michael,

I have a couple of E-fax numbers too, still don't want junk mail coming to them though;) :)

[Michael Harris]

Kathie,

I prefer no junk, but at least with eFax, you do ot waste the paper to find out if the message is worthwhile. ;)

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Michael,

That's true, paper and especially ink cartridges get expensive. I've been buying the ink refill kits, which are about 1/3 of the cost of a regular cartridge, or less:)

One of my printers is a photo printer, it prints directly from my digital camera memory stick, so I haven't found any cartridges for that, due to the special colors and quality required.

[Michael Harris]

Kathie,

I go through at least one black ink cartridge a week. My loan signing business eats them up. Actual cost for a large package is $25! :(

How good are the ink refill kits these days? In 1996, I had a coworker who tried the refill kits - he was black for two weeks.:D

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Michael,

My experience with the refill kits has been good so far, no ink blots or smudges or anything. It can be messy refilling if not done right, per the instructions, which detail how to refill, depending on the type of printer/cartridge. I've found the cartridges can only be refilled about 3-4 times and then they need to be replaced because the print heads wear out, but it saves about $70-$80 in cartridge replacement costs :)

[Michael Harris]

Good Morning Kathie,

Thank you for the information. I may need to look into one of the refill kits.. :cool:

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Michael,

You're welcome. The last refill kit I purchased was $12.00 and it contained enough black ink for 3 refills . The color refill was about $20.00 and had enough ink for 2-3 refills. Not bad, since color cartridges for my printer cost about $30-$35 each and the black cartridges are about $25-$30 each (when they're on sale). Good luck and let me know how it works out. If you get ink all over you and make a big mess, post a picture for me:D

[Michael Harris]

Kathie,

Oh, ye of little faith! :o

If I get ink all over myself, I will never tell. :D

[Kathleen Padgett]

Awe... please can I see the pictures if you get ink all over? :D

[Michael Harris]

Kathie,

If I can save money and IPIU will let me post pictures of me covered with inlk, you have a deal. ;)

[Colleen L Hayes -]

Hi everyone,

Since the national 'Do Not Call List' is on everyone's mind these days, I thought the following information may be useful.
* * * * * * * * * * * *

Has your evening or weekend been disrupted by a call from a telemarketer? If so, you’re not alone. The Federal Communications Commission (FCC) has been receiving complaints in increasing numbers from consumers throughout the nation about unwanted and uninvited calls to their homes from telemarketers.


Recently, pursuant to its broad authority under the Telephone Consumer Protection Act (TCPA), the FCC established a national Do-Not-Call Registry. The registry is nationwide in scope, applies to all telemarketers (with the exception of certain non-profit organizations), and covers both interstate and intrastate telemarketing calls. Commercial telemarketers are not allowed to call you if your number is on the registry. As a result, consumers can, if they choose, reduce the number of unwanted phone calls to their homes.

Do-Not-Call Registry



You can register your phone number for free, and it will remain on the national do-not-call list for five years. You may re-enter your number onto the list when the five years have passed, and you may remove your name from the list at any time.

The Do-Not-Call registry will not prevent all unwanted calls. It will not cover the following:

calls from organizations with which you have established a business relationship;

calls for which you have given prior written consent;

calls which are not commercial or do not include unsolicited advertisements;

calls by or on behalf of tax-exempt non-profit organizations.


How to Register



Consumers can register on-line for the national do-not-call registry beginning June 27, 2003. Telephone registration will open for consumers in states west of the Mississippi River - including Minnesota and Louisiana - on the same date. Telephone registration will be available July 7 in the entire country. To register, consumers may call 1-888-382-1222: for TTY call 1-866-290-4236. You must call from the phone number you wish to register. The registry will become effective on October 1, 2003.

Subscribers may register their residential telephone number, including wireless numbers, on the national Do-Not-Call registry by telephone or by Internet at no cost.

The federal Do-Not-Call registry will be effective October 1, 2003.



Related Rules



In addition to the establishment of a national Do-Not-Call Registry, there are other amendments to the Commission's rules implementing the TCPA that may reduce the number of telemarketing calls to your home when they become effective:

If you subscribe to CALLER ID, you will know when a telemarketer is calling you: telemarketers will be required to transmit Caller ID information and may not block their numbers.

Telemarketers must ensure that predictive dialers abandon no more than three percent of all calls placed and answered by a person. A call will be considered "abandoned" if it is not transferred to a live sales agent within two seconds of the recipient's greeting. As a result, you may less likely run to answer the phone only to find silence or the "click" of the calling party disconnecting the line.

In addition to these changes the rules currently provide:

Telephone solicitation calls to your home before 8 am or after 9 pm are prohibited.

Anyone making a telephone solicitation call to your home must provide his/her name, the name of the entity on whose behalf the call is being made, and a telephone number or address at which you may contact that entity.

Company-specific do-not-call lists are available to consumers who wish to avoid telemarketing calls only from specific companies. For more information see our Unwanted Telephone Marketing Calls Factsheet


How to Complain



Once the Registry becomes effective October 1, 2003, if you receive an unwanted telemarketing call and you have requested your telephone number on the Registry, you can file a complaint by either e-mail (fccinfo@fcc.gov), the Internet, telephone 1-888-CALL-FCC (1-888-225-5322) voice or 1-888-TELL-FCC (1-888-835-5322) TTY, or mail.

Your complaint letter should include:

name, address, and telephone number where you can be reached during the business day;

the telephone number involved with the complaint; and

as much specific information about the complaint as possible, including the identity of the telemarketer or company contacting you;

If mailing in a complaint, send it to:

Federal Communications Commission
Consumer & Governmental Affairs Bureau
Consumer Inquiries and Complaint Division
445 12th Street, SW
Washington, DC 20554

For general information, you may contact the FCC’s Consumer & Governmental Affairs Bureau in the following ways:

Via Internet at www.fcc.gov/cgb
Consumer Center, Voice: 1-888-CALL-FCC (1-888-225-5322) and
TTY: 1-888-TELL-FCC (1-888-835-5322)

For this or any other consumer publication in an alternative format (electronic ASCII text, Braille, large print, or audio) please write or call us at the address or phone number below, or send an e-mail to FCC504@fcc.gov.

[Michael Harris]

Colleen,

Thank you. I was not aware of a ll the exceptions. This is somewhat disappointing.

But I am on the list - it has to help. ;)

[Colleen L Hayes -]

Hi Michael,

Definitely, it will help. I thought it was interesting that companies can't send a fax without prior approval from the recipient.

[Michael Harris]

Colleen,

I had one of my trade associations send me an email with a fax request in it. :D

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Colleen,

Thanks for the additional info:)

[Colleen L Hayes -]

Originally posted by Michael Harris
Colleen,

I had one of my trade associations send me an email with a fax request in it. :D

Michael,

You are just toooooooooo funny. Did you and yours' have a good holiday weekend?
:cool: :D

[Colleen L Hayes -]

Originally posted by Kathleen Padgett
Hi Colleen,

Thanks for the additional info:)

Kathie,

You're very welcome. I hope it helped clarify some things for people you weren't sure exactly what was happening. I hope you had a great holiday weekend.

:)

[Michael Harris]

Colleen,

We had a very quite, safe holiday. thank you for your concern. :)

[Kathleen Padgett]

Colleen,

The holiday weekend was fantastic! I had a blast sea kayaking, hiking, sightseeing, camping, and shopping in Maine. It didn't even rain, what a nice change from the weather pattern this year.:) Back to work now, winding down from vaca mode and trying to catch up on everything;) Wish I'd won the lottery over the weekend, it was a big jackpot. Somebody in NH won and I'm sure they didn't have to go to work:D

[Michele Maconship]

Originally posted by Kathleen Padgett
. . . Wish I'd won the lottery over the weekend, it was a big jackpot. Somebody in NH won and I'm sure they didn't have to go to work:D

:) Don't we all! We have started playing the lotto recently as a "group" here at the office, hoping that the odds will be a bit better.

Every Monday morning, the standing joke is "Well, guess we didn't win the lotto; everybody is still here . . . !"

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Michele,

Cheers to that, I'll keep trying to win:D Never hurts to dream, and wonder what it's like not to have to work;)

[Michael Harris]

'Do-Not-Call' List Left in Legal Limbo

By DAVID HO, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - A fight between Congress and the courts over a national "do-not-call" list is mired in legal limbo, with consumers wondering whether promised relief from telemarketers will happen.

Supporters of the free government service had barely begun to celebrate an overwhelming vote Thursday in Congress to counter a federal court ruling when they learned that another judge had blocked the list from taking effect next week.

"It puts a little damper on the party," said Ken Johnson, spokesman for Rep. Billy Tauzin, R-La., chairman of the House Energy and Commerce Committee. "But we're still confident of prevailing in the end."

Tauzin led an effort in the House to pass a bill making clear that the Federal Trade Commission has the authority to enforce the do-not-call registry. The legislation was prompted by a ruling Tuesday by U.S. District Court Judge Lee R. West in Oklahoma City that said the FTC lacked the power to create and operate the registry.

"Clearly the court's decision was misguided," said Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz.

The House voted 412-8 and the Senate 95-0 for the bill Thursday. President Bush said he looked forward to signing it. "Unwanted telemarketing calls are intrusive, annoying and all too common," he said in a statement.

But late in the day, U.S. District Judge Edward W. Nottingham in Denver blocked the list, handing another victory to telemarketers who argued the national registry will devastate their industry and lead to the loss of thousands of jobs.

Nottingham said the do-not-call list was unconstitutional under the First Amendment because it does not apply equally to all kinds of speech, blocking commercial telemarketing calls but not calls from charities. "The FTC has chosen to entangle itself too much in the consumer's decision by manipulating consumer choice," Nottingham wrote.

The list, which would block an estimated 80 percent of telemarketing calls, is supposed to be effective Wednesday, but it's unclear whether legal issues will be settled by then. Even after Bush signs the legislation, the FTC must win in court for the list to move forward.

Despite the uncertainty, the FTC is encouraging people to continue signing up for the list at the Web site www.donotcall.gov or by calling 1-888-382-1222.

West rejected an FTC request to delay his order, saying the agency offered no additional evidence that would make him change his mind. The FTC immediately appealed to the 10th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Denver.

The commission had no immediate comment on Nottingham's ruling.

While it was unclear how West's order would affect the FTC's plans, the second ruling more directly prohibits the government from enforcing the do-not-call list. The constitutional issues raised also may not be solved as easily.

The first court ruling caught lawmakers off guard, but they responded with remarkable speed. Bills can take months or even years to pass, but the do-not-call legislation was drafted and approved in both chambers in little more than 24 hours.

The rapid response underscored the popularity of the list in an election year. After fewer than four months, it already has nearly 51 million numbers.

Rep. Edward Markey, D-Mass., said he was one of the first people to sign up. "This legislation got to the House floor faster than a consumer can hang up on a telemarketer at dinnertime," he said.

Since issuing the ruling, West's home and office have been bombarded with calls from angry consumers. His numbers were posted on the Internet and people were encouraged to call.

Late Thursday, Nottingham's phone numbers began to surface online as well.

The case decided by West was brought by a coalition of telemarketers, including the Direct Marketing Association, an industry group.

The suit in Nottingham's court was filed by two telemarketing companies and the American Teleservices Association, which represents call centers. The association has another lawsuit pending in Denver against the Federal Communications Commission, which added its authority to the list to block calls from certain industries, including airlines, banks and telephone companies.

The FTC's rules require telemarketers to check the list every three months to see who does not want to be called. Those who call listed people could be fined up to $11,000 for each violation. Consumers would file complaints to an automated phone or online system.

Exemptions to the list include calls from charities, pollsters and on behalf of politicians.

On the Net: National Do Not Call Registry: http://www.donotcall.gov
Judge West's order rejecting request to block earlier ruling: http://www.okwd.uscourts.gov/files/03-cv-122order
U.S. District Court in Denver: http://www.co.uscourts.gov

Copyright 2003 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

The issue is not Freedom of Speech, but Freedom from Speech. There is a difference.

[Shiela M Hargett]

Regarding the junk mail...

You know that "postage paid" envelop they would send with the junk mail? I would tear up all the information except the envelop and stuff their envelop with the stuff they sent me and send it back to them "postage paid" by them.

Miraculously, my junk mail has gone down quite a bit since then. :)

[Edward Taguba]

Shela,

Wow thats is good. I should try that haha

[Elizabeth Black -]

Hi!

This makes me thank about how much this is going to cost to settle this dispute?
:rolleyes:

[Michael Harris]

Shiela,

I have heard of that trick being used. You just have to make sure that the envelope is less than 16 ounces. :) :D :cool:

[Roy Leech]

Thanks Kathie, those people are very irritating!!


Roy Leech

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hello everyone,

I heard about the do not call list legal issues in dispute as well. What a bummer! I hope they resolve this soon, we need that list!

[Vickie Scott]

Is this do not call list going to go or not? gezzzzzzzzz even AT&T is calling 3 and 4 times a day! And I am ALREADY a customer.. I think the next time a telemarketer calls, I'm going to ask them to hold on for a sec, and just lay the phone down.:eek:

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi Vickie,

I couldn't agree more... I noticed an immediate increase in phone calls this week, since the activation of the do not call list was threatened. I got 4 telemarketing calls in a row on Saturday morning, aggrivating!!

Congress needs to act to give the FTC and the FCC the power and authority to implement this do not call list into law. Let's hope all the recent publicity brings enough attention to this issue to solve it once and for all. Consumers need protection!

[Kathleen Padgett]

Check this report out... hmmm, very interesting.

Judge Who Nixed Call Registry Is on List
By DAVID HO, AP

DENVER (Sept. 28) - The office phone number of a federal judge who ruled last week that a national do-not-call registry is unconstitutional was among the thousands already on the list.


Getty Images
Telemarketer at work in New York City

U.S. District Judge Edward Nottingham's number was added in July to the registry, which was designed to block telemarketers' calls.

It wasn't clear whether Nottingham himself registered the number or knew it had been registered. A call to the office Saturday was not immediately returned.

Nottingham on Thursday stopped the Federal Trade Commission from implementing the registry, ruling it was an unconstitutional infringement on free speech.



The FTC Web site was set up to allow anyone to register their number, remove it or verify whether a number was registered. An automated response from the site verified that Nottingham's number was registered on July 28.

The Boston Globe reported the listing in its Saturday editions and said Nottingham did not return its messages seeking comment Friday.


09-28-03 14:28 EDT

;)

[Kathleen Padgett]

Hi everyone,

Please see below for the latest update on the National Do Not Call Registry. You can also check your own state's do not call sites for additional information and to gain an understanding of how the National and State do not call lists relate to each other.

What's the Status of the
National Do Not Call Registry?

Consumers should know:

The FTC will appeal the decision of the federal court in Denver and expects ultimately to implement the National Do Not Call Registry.

You can still put your number on the national registry, but for now, telemarketers are not required to comply with it.

You can limit telemarketing calls by asking a company to put you on its own do not call list. The FTC and its state partners will enforce this provision.


What did the federal court in Denver decide?

On September 25, 2003, the U.S. District Court in Denver ruled that the National Do Not Call Registry provisions of the TSR violate the First Amendment, and prohibited the FTC from implementing the registry. The decision can be found at http://www.co.uscourts.gov/opinions/ewn_030184.pdf


What's the FTC going to do now?

The FTC will appeal this decision to the 10th Circuit Court of Appeals and expects ultimately to implement the national registry. In the meantime, consumers can still put their numbers on the registry, but telemarketers will not be required to comply with it.


How can consumers limit telemarketing calls?

Consumers who don't want to receive telemarketing calls can limit them by telling companies to put their number on the company's do not call list. Write down the name of the company and the date that you asked to be put on its do not call list. You should not receive further calls from that company. This provision of the Telemarketing Sales Rule is still in force (as are all non-do-call provisions of the Rule). The FTC and its state partners are committed to enforcing the company-specific provisions of the Rule.

The company-specific do not call rules apply to all telemarketing calls, including calls from companies with which you have done business and telemarketing calls on behalf of charities.

[Shiela M Hargett]

Well, I've yet to receive one returned to me for "postage due" because it weighed too much. :p

So it was either the correct weight or less, I suppose.

[Michael Harris]

Shiela,

The issue is that the USPS considers anything up to 16 oz. as first class and the heavier stuff as Priority mail. They might get suspicious with mail that is too heavy.

[Michael Harris]

http://kyw.com
Do-Not-Call List On Again, For Now
Sep 30, 2003 2:41 pm US/Eastern
The operators of the national do-not-call list are moving to prevent people from adding new numbers to the registry because of a convoluted legal battle that could stretch into next year, regulators said Tuesday.

People with numbers already registered will likely see a decrease in some telemarketing calls beginning Wednesday -- the original deadline for blocking telemarketing calls to the more than 50 million phone numbers in the registry -- but regulators concede that the protection is increasingly uncertain.

"We shut down everything to do with the registry already except the sign-up mechanism and we are in the process of trying to figure out how we do that," Federal Trade Commission Chairman Timothy Muris told reporters after testifying to a Senate committee. "Unless something happens differently shortly, we'll take orderly steps to accomplish that."

In the last week, the bewildering battle between the government and telemarketers has involved two federal judges, an appeals court, both houses of Congress, the White House, the Supreme Court and two federal agencies.

After a federal judge blocked the FTC from enforcing the registry, the Federal Communications Commission stepped in to enforce the list, promising to penalize telemarketers who call the numbers in the registry. Telemarketers who call listed numbers could face FCC fines of up to $120,000.

While people can complain directly to the FCC about calls, the main system for filing do-not-call complaints online and by phone have been shut down, the FTC's Muris said.

"This doesn't mean that consumers will be without protection," Muris said. "It will just be a more cumbersome and difficult system."

Many of the largest telemarketers say they will abide by the list despite the legal challenges, but a court ruling late Monday has made it even more difficult for the FCC to receive complaints and punish telemarketers who call listed people.

FCC Chairman Michael Powell said people can file complaints by visiting his agency's Web site or calling 1-888-225-5322.

"We know how to do it manually," Powell told reporters outside the Senate hearing. "It will be a little tougher but it's not shut down."

Muris said the publicity over the legal fight has caused registration for the list to surge, with hundreds of thousands of new numbers added. He said the legal fight that has blocked his agency from enforcing the list could last into next year, but on Wednesday, consumers can expect a significant decrease in calls "assuming telemarketers comply."

Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., chairman of the Senate Commerce Committee holding the hearing, bemoaned the growing uncertainties of the registry.

"A concept that to most people is as simple as 'do not call me' has become tremendously complex," McCain said. "It is unclear whether American families gathering at the dinner table will be bombarded tomorrow with the same unwanted calls that they receive today."

Late Monday, the judge who blocked the FTC warned that the agency could face more legal action for using the FCC "to skirt the order."

U.S. District Judge Edward W. Nottingham in Denver denied an FTC request to suspend his decision while the agency appeals. In his ruling, he said he clearly prohibited the FTC from operating the registry and the law prevents any indirect actions to get around that.

The free service was originally intended to block about 80 percent of telemarketer calls. Exemptions included calls from charities, pollsters and on behalf of politicians.

The do-not-call list works by requiring telemarketers to pay for a copy of the list so they can know who to avoid calling. Many telemarketers have the list, but some do not and cannot obtain it since the FTC shut down that aspect of the program on Sunday in response to the court rulings.

The FCC can only penalize telemarketers who have gotten the list, meaning that some businesses may keep calling consumers without fear of reprisals.

While many members of the Direct Marketing Association, the largest telemarketer association, have agreed to comply with the list, some worry they might be penalized whether they have the list or not.

Telemarketers without the list are in a Catch-22 situation because they can't get it and are afraid to make calls because they might be fined for calling listed numbers, said Jerry Cerasale, a senior vice president with the association.

(© 2003 The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed. )

[Kathleen Padgett]

This situation with the do not call list is such a mess, I can only hope a permanent solution is enacted soon. The bureaucracy is ridiculous and slow moving. Somebody needs to just step up to the plate and take responsibility for a reasonable solution and decisive action.

[Michael Harris]

Hi Kathie,

The only people being ignored in the process are the 200 million of us who are having our rights trampled on.

When you have to balance the rights of the telemarketers (the little people who make a pitiful living annoying people) against the rights of the rest of the citizens, it had better be the masses who come out ahead.

And it is not a 1st Amendment issue. I doubt that some of these judges have even read the Constitution.

[Michael Harris]

Here is another view on the issue.


Do-Not-Call List to Start, Future Unclear

]By DAVID HO, Associated Press Writer[/i]

WASHINGTON - The millions of people who signed up for the government's do-not-call list should get fewer sales pitches from telemarketers starting Wednesday, but for how long is anybody's guess.

A confusing legal fight has thrown the list into disarray, forcing federal officials to rework the system to handle complaints and enforce penalties.

For now, officials are directing those consumers who registered phone numbers on the list to send complaints to the Federal Communications Commission by visiting www.fcc.gov/cgb/complaints.html or calling 1-888-225-5322.

FCC staff, who until recently had no plans to handle all do-not-call complaints, were scrambling to prepare. Outdated instructions for filing complaints related to the list were still on government phone messages and Web sites Tuesday afternoon.

"You've gone from an automated and highly efficient enforcement system to a manual one," FCC Chairman Michael Powell told reporters after testifying to a Senate committee. "It will be a little tougher, but it's not shut down."

The list contains more than 50 million home and cell phone numbers. Companies could face thousands of dollars in fines each time they call a registered number.

The Federal Trade Commission said Tuesday it is moving to stop accepting new numbers while a court fight with telemarketers seeking to stop the list plays out. Despite the legal wrangling, many of the largest telemarketers say they will abide by the list.

Consumers can expect a significant decrease in calls, "assuming telemarketers comply," said Federal Trade Commission Chairman Timothy Muris. The FTC was blocked from operating and enforcing the list last week by a federal judge who said the program violates the free speech rights of telemarketers. Muris said the legal fight could last into next year.

"This doesn't mean that consumers will be without protection," Muris said. "It will just be a more cumbersome and difficult system."

The list was intended to block about 80 percent of telemarketing calls. Exemptions include calls from charities, pollsters and on behalf of politicians. A company also may call a person on the no-call list if that person has bought, leased or rented from the company within the past 18 months or has inquired about or applied for something during the past three months.

Recent legal challenges and the government's makeshift fixes to keep the list in business have left other holes in the registry's protections.

The do-not-call list works by requiring telemarketers to pay for a copy of the list so they can know whom to avoid calling. Many telemarketers have the list, but some do not and cannot obtain it since the FTC shut down that aspect of the program on Sunday in response to the court rulings.

The FCC can only penalize those who have the list.

Powell said that while investigating complaints, the FCC would ask a telemarketing firm accused of a violation whether it had the list. "Lying to us is a dangerous thing," he said, noting that deceiving the agency could result in serious legal actions.

Some telemarketers say the legal confusion has their industry in turmoil, with many unsure about which numbers can and can't be called and what actions will result in penalties.

Home phone numbers for 11 top telemarketing executives are on the do-not-call list, The Hartford Courant reported on its Web site Tuesday. One of them is Jerry Cerasale, a senior vice president with the Direct Marketing Association.

"Internet registration is subject to abuse," Cerasale said before the Senate committee.

Telemarketers criticize the list for allowing the registration of any phone number online with only an e-mail address for confirmation. Cerasale is one of several people from the DMA placed on the list without their permission, said association spokesman Louis Mastria.

In the last week, the bewildering battle between the government and telemarketers has involved two federal judges, an appeals court, both houses of Congress, the White House, the Supreme Court and two federal agencies.

Late Monday, U.S. District Judge Edward W. Nottingham in Denver denied a request to suspend his decision blocking the FTC from running the list. He also warned the agency could face more legal action for using the FCC to skirt the order.

On Tuesday, the FTC asked the Denver-based 10th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals to suspend Nottingham's ruling that blocked the agency from operating the list. Government officials from 45 states, the District of Columbia and Puerto Rico filed a brief with the court supporting the FTC.

Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., chairman of the Senate Commerce Committee holding the hearing, bemoaned the uncertainties.

"A concept that to most people is as simple as `do not call me' has become tremendously complex," McCain said.

On the Net: FTC: http://www.ftc.gov – FCC: http://www.fcc.gov

Copyright 2003 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

[Boyd Dotson]

Hello all,

I am so thankful for the National Do Not Call Registry. I sure hope it takes place.

But it probably will not happen because someone is not getting enough kick back or money to line his or her pockets with. That is all the telemarketing companies need to do now is to pay out more money to the right people and they will win.


I sure hope not! They are invading our privacy at home, unless we ask them to call us. We are not businesses but are families. This is a Invasion of privacy.

Take care and have a great day.

[Michael Harris]

Originally posted by Boyd Dotson
I am so thankful for the National Do Not Call Registry. I sure hope it takes place....
Boyd,

I agree with you. My phone at home rings so often. :(

[Kathleen Padgett]

I sure hope the do not call list stays in effect also... telemarketers are so pushy and call far too frequently, they just don't like to take NO for an answer. This seems like common sense, not to bother people who don't want their calls.

Boyd is probably right, it might just come down to who pays off who, I don't appreciate the bureacracy and politics, but it's the reality of Congress:(

[Michael Harris]

Here is the email side of the issue.

The one piece that no one is talking about is our right to not listen to sales calls.


Do-Not-Spam List Probably Won't Work

Thu Oct 16, 2:50 PM
By ANICK JESDANUN, AP Internet Writer

NEW YORK - The premise sounds simple: To cut down on junk e-mail, simply submit your addresses to a "do-not-spam" list that marketers would have to check to avoid fines. With more than 50 million phone numbers already on a federal do-not-call list, many e-mail users are eager for a no-spam counterpart.

But don't hold out much hope, even if one is created. Phone and e-mail systems _ and the marketers who employ them _ are fundamentally different.

"It's beyond even an apples-to-oranges comparison," said Nicholas Graham, a spokesman for America Online Inc.

Even supporters say a no-spam list would be no panacea.

"I don't think anyone out there is going to tell you that a do-not-e-mail registry is going to be as effective as a do-not-call registry," said Matthew Prince, co-founder of Unspam LLC, a Chicago startup that developed technology to run such an anti-spam list.

Not that the cautions are stopping the efforts.

Sen. Charles Schumer, D-N.Y., has a bill to create a national do-not-spam list. State senates in Louisiana and Michigan have passed similar legislation, and bills have been introduced in other states. Violators could be fined _ and in Michigan, even sent to jail.

An industry trade group, the Direct Marketing Association, already keeps a no-spam list of 700,000 e-mail addresses that its members are asked to heed. Also, at least three private companies started their own no-spam lists this year. Two of them charge the public for inclusion.

But these lists have no enforcement power.

"When the do-not-call list hit 30 million names, we just said, `Wow,'" said Tom Jackson, chief executive of Global Removal Inc., which charges $5 per individual e-mail address.

Bryan Hunter, who runs the $9.95-a-year Remove.org, claims lists such as his help marketers better target pitches. "They realize these are people who aren't going to buy their products," he said.

But John Levine, board member of the Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial Email (CAUCE), dismisses such companies as toothless. Without the legal standing of a government list, such private efforts "range from naively ineffective to complete 00000," he said.

Michigan Attorney General Mike Cox has threatened a deceptive-marketing lawsuit against Remove.org. The company has since toned down its Web site, but an investigation is continuing.

Meanwhile, the chairman of the Federal Trade Commission, which runs the do-not-call list, doubts whether a government-run counterpart for spam would work.

E-mail systems are spread out around the globe, and information about the e-mail sender is easy to fake. The phone network is centralized and regulated, tends to follow national boundaries and has fixed circuits that are less prone to spoofing. Together, that makes telemarketers easier than spammers to catch.

People also change e-mail addresses more frequently than phone numbers, making any no-spam list quickly old.

And while telemarketers are largely businesses pitching legitimate products, spammers are more likely to promote deceptive get-rich-quick or get-anatomically enlarged-quick schemes.

If spammers aren't following consumer-protection laws now, they likely won't adhere to any lists, said Bob Wientzen, chief executive of the Direct Marketing Association.

"We're very concerned that the American public might be sold a bill of goods," Wientzen said, acknowledging his group's own list has done little to stop spam.

A no-spam list also raises security issues: Just think of what could happen if a spammer got hold of such a database. Prince and others, however, say such lists can be encrypted.

Critics also say spammers abroad would be difficult to locate and subject to U.S. laws. However, Ray Everett-Church, counsel for CAUCE, is unfazed.

"The server may be in China or Brazil, but the person advertising in that e-mail is most likely either based in the United States or has some jurisdictional tie to the United States," Everett-Church said.

Where no-call and no-spam lists converge is in the debate over their constitutionality.

A federal court in Denver has ruled that the no-call list violates the telemarketing industry's free-speech rights. An appeals court, however, has temporarily blocked the order.

David Sorkin, a John Marshall Law School professor who tracks spam laws, said a no-spam list would likely face similar challenges. But he notes that junk-fax prohibitions have survived such tests.

As for whether it would work, Sorkin is skeptical. He doesn't believe it would do much to stop today's breed of spam, though it could prevent e-mail marketing by legitimate businesses that haven't quite taken advantage of the medium yet.

So after all that, you'll still see your mailbox filled with Nigerian _ or is it Liberian? _ investment opportunities. But at least your phone won't ring as often while you hit the delete key.

Anick Jesdanun can be reached at netwriter(at)ap.org

Copyright 2003 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

[Dragos Sfinteanu]

"Diplomacy"

As a child I was taught some of the "Ten Commandments" by my mother. I remember her insisting especially the "Do not lie". When I became a teenager, my mother refined a little bit the commandment, suggesting that God could forgive me if I would say only a part of the truth in order to avoid a bad or unpleasant situation. She named this "diplomacy".

Always when I get a call from a telemarketer I instantly remember the "diplomacy", answering polite but firmly "Sory, but I was just leaving. Bye, bye"

[Glenn N Klipp]

I have heard of one approach to telemarketers. When they call, tell them its not a convenient time, and then ask for their number so you can return the call. When they tell you that they cannot give out their number, just say that its only fair, as they have your number. May not solve the problem, but its fun to do.:)

[Nicholas R Keith -]

Thanks Kathie for the links.I just signed up my family.Have a good week!:)

[Glenn N Klipp]

I may just sign up myself. The only problem then is that my telephone will never ring.:D

[Michael Harris]

Glenn,

Since I signed up my house phone and my cells phones, the only unsolicited calls I get are on my fax line. :confused:

[Michael Whiteaker -]

Congress is working on a junk email ban, but the way our U.S. government works...

[Michael Harris]

Michael,

I hope that was not a political comment.

So many laws start out as good intentions (paving the way to h-e-l-l), but get mangled in conference and by self-serving members of the various committees or even by the people who write the implementing regulations.

They do try when it its in their best interests.

[Michael Whiteaker -]

Michael,

I hope that was not a political comment.

So many laws start out as good intentions...They do try when it its in their best interests.
Well, it wan't so much a political statement, but you got my gist correctly.

I know congress has said they want to get rid of spam. Who doesn't? It would be foolish for anyone in congress to say they didn't want to get rid of spam.

But, from that point on, who knows what will actually happen. Even with truly good intentions things can go wrong. :rolleyes: