PI LICENSING: Ohio

[Legal Affairs]

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NO LICENSE NEEDED, IF WORKING FOR THE FOLLOWING::
61522. Exemptions: No License Needed for: An employee in the regular course of the employee's employment, engaged in investigating matters pertinent to the business of his or her employer or protecting property in the possession of his or her employer, provided the employer is deducting all applicable state and federal employment taxes on behalf of the employee and neither the employer nor the employee is employed by, associated with, or acting for or on behalf of any private investigator or security guard provider;


No License Needed for: Attorneys at law or any expert hired by an attorney at law for consultation or litigation purposes;


No License Needed for: Any person residing in this state who, for hire or otherwise, conducts research for the purpose of locating persons to whom the state of Ohio owes money in the form of warrants, as defined in division (S) of section 131.01 of the Revised Code, that the state voided but subsequently reissues.


No License Needed for: Any person residing in this state who conducts research for the purpose of locating the last known owner of unclaimed funds, provided that the person is in compliance with Chapter 169. of the Revised Code and rules adopted thereunder. The exemption set forth in division (H)(10) of this section applies only to the extent that the person is conducting research for the purpose of locating the last known owner of unclaimed funds.


No License Needed for: Any better business bureau or similar organization or any of its employees while engaged in the maintenance of the quality of business activities relating to consumer sales and services;


No License Needed for: Any person who, for hire or otherwise, conducts genealogical research in this state.


No License Needed for: A consumer reporting agency, as defined in the "Fair Credit Reporting Act," 84 Stat. 1128, 15 U.S.C.A. 1681a, as amended, provided that the consumer reporting agency is in compliance with the requirements of that act.


No License Needed for: The issuance of consumer credit reports;


No License Needed for: The conducting of limited background investigations that pertain only to a client's prospective tenant and that are engaged in with the prior written consent of the prospective tenant;


No License Needed for: The business of pre-employment background investigations. As used in division (H)(3)(c) of this section, "business of pre-employment background investigation" means, and is limited to, furnishing for hire, in person or through a partner or employees, the conducting of limited background investigations, in-person interviews, telephone interviews, or written inquiries that pertain only to a client's prospective employee and the employee's employment and that are engaged in with the prior written consent of the prospective employee.


No License Needed for: Personnel placement services licensed under Chapter 4143. of the Revised Code and persons who act as employees of such entities engaged in investigating matters related to personnel placement activities;


No License Needed for: Certified public insurance adjusters that hold a certificate of authority issued pursuant to sections 3951.01 to 3951.09 of the Revised Code, while the adjuster is investigating the cause of or responsibility for a fire, accident, or other damage to property with respect to a claim or claims for loss or damage under a policy of insurance covering real or personal property;


No License Needed for: An accountant who is registered or certified under Chapter 4701. of the Revised Code or any of the accountant's employees while engaged in activities for which the accountant is certified or registered;


No License Needed for: A professional engineer who is registered under Chapter 4733. of the Revised Code or any of his employees.


No License Needed for: An independent insurance adjuster who, as an individual, an independent contractor, an employee of an independent contractor, adjustment bureau association, corporation, insurer, partnership, local recording agent, managing general agent, or self-insurer, engages in the business of independent insurance adjustment, or any person who supervises the handling of claims except while acting as an employee of an insurer licensed in this state while handling claims pertaining to specific policies written by that insurer.


No License Needed for: An attorney who adjusts insurance losses incidential [sic] to the practice of law and who does not advertise or represent that he or she is an independent insurance adjuster;


No License Needed for: A licensed agent or general agent of an insurer licensed in this state who processes undisputed or uncontested losses for insurers under policies issued by that agent or general agent.


No License Needed for: Public officers and employees whose official duties require them to engage in investigatory activities;

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NEW RESOURCES:

For a copy of the State Law in PDF form: Click Here (http://www.homelandsecurity.ohio.gov/PISG_information/HLS0015_PISG_Laws_Rules.pdf)


To go to the PI License Department Home Page: Click Here (http://www.homelandsecurity.ohio.gov/ohs_pisg.stm)


To check on a PI License: Click Here (http://www.dps.state.oh.us/ALRS/alrshomepage.aspx)


State PI License Home Page:
http://www.homelandsecurity.ohio.gov/ohs_pisg.stm

Verify a license:
https://www.dps.state.oh.us/ALRS/alrshomepage.aspx
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TO OBTAIN A LICENSE TO SOLICIT FOR YOUR OWN CLIENTS:

(A)(1) Any individual, including a partner in a partnership, may be

licensed as a private investigator under a class B license, or as a

security guard provider under a class C license, or as a private

investigator and a security guard provider under a class A license, if

he meets the following requirements:



(a) He has a good reputation for integrity, has not been convicted of a

felony within the last twenty years or any offense involving moral

turpitude, and has not been adjudicated incompetent for the purpose of

holding the license, as provided in section 5122.301 of the Revised

Code, without having been restored to legal capacity for that purpose.



(b) Depending upon the class of license for which application is made,

for a continuous period of at least two years immediately preceding

application for a license, he has been engaged in investigatory or

security services work for a law enforcement or other public agency

engaged in investigatory activities, or for a private investigator or

security guard provider, or engaged in the practice of law, or has

acquired equivalent experience as determined by rule of the director of

commerce.



(c) He demonstrates his competency as a private investigator or security

guard provider by passing an examination devised for this purpose by the

director, except that any individually licensed person who qualifies a

corporation for licensure shall not be required to be reexamined if he

qualifies the corporation in the same capacity that he was individually

licensed.



(d) He submits evidence of comprehensive general liability insurance

coverage, or other equivalent guarantee approved by the director in such

form and in principal amounts satisfactory to the director, but not less

than one hundred thousand dollars for each person and three hundred

thousand dollars for each occurrence for bodily injury liability, and

one hundred thousand dollars for property damage liability.



(e) He pays the requisite examination and license fees.



(2) A corporation may be licensed as a private investigator under a

class B license, or as a security guard provider under a class C

license, or as a private investigator and a security guard provider

under a class A license, if an application for licensure is filed by an

officer of the corporation and he, another officer, or the qualifying

agent of the corporation satisfies the requirements of divisions (A)(1)

and (F)(1) of this section. Officers and the statutory agent of a

corporation shall be determined in accordance with Chapter 1701. of the

Revised Code.



(3) At least one partner in a partnership shall be licensed as a private

investigator, or as a security guard provider, or as a private

investigator and a security guard provider. Partners in a partnership

shall be determined as provided for in Chapter 1775. of the Revised

Code.



(B) Application for a class A, B, or C license shall be in writing,

under oath, to the director. In the case of an individual, the

application shall state the applicant's name, birth date, citizenship,

physical description, current residence, residences for the preceding

ten years, current employment, employment for the preceding seven years,

experience qualifications, the location of each of his offices in this

state, and any other information that is necessary in order for the

director to comply with the requirements of this chapter. In the case of

a corporation, the application shall state the name of the officer or

qualifying agent filing the application; the state in which the

corporation is incorporated and the date of incorporation; the states in

which the corporation is authorized to transact business; the name of

its qualifying agent; the name of the officer or qualifying agent of the

corporation who satisfies the requirements of divisions (A)(1) and

(F)(1) of this section and the birth date, citizenship, physical

description, current residence, residences for the preceding ten years,

current employment, employment for the preceding seven years, and

experience qualifications of that officer or qualifying agent; and other

information that the director requires. A corporation may specify in its

application information relative to one or more individuals who satisfy

the requirements of divisions (A)(1) and (F)(1) of this section.



The application shall be accompanied by:



(1) One recent full-face photograph of the applicant or, in the case of

a corporation, of each officer or qualifying agent specified in the

application as satisfying the requirements of divisions (A)(1) and

(F)(1) of this section;



(2) One complete set of the applicant's fingerprints or, in the case of

a corporation, of the fingerprints of each officer or qualifying agent

specified in the application as satisfying the requirements of divisions

(A)(1) and (F)(1) of this section;



(3) Character references from at least five reputable citizens for the

applicant or, in the case of a corporation, for each officer or

qualifying agent specified in the application as satisfying the

requirements of divisions (A)(1) and (F)(1) of this section, each of

whom has known the applicant, officer, or qualifying agent for at least

five years preceding the application, and none of whom are connected

with the applicant, officer, or qualifying agent by blood or marriage;

*61530 (4) An examination fee of twenty-five dollars for the applicant

or, in the case of a corporation, for each officer or qualifying agent

specified in the application as satisfying the requirements of divisions

(A)(1) and (F)(1) of this section, and a license fee of two hundred

fifty dollars. The license fee shall be refunded if a license is not

issued.



(C) Upon receipt of the application and accompanying matter, the

director shall forward to the bureau of criminal identification and

investigation a request that it make an investigation of the applicant

or, in the case of a corporation, each officer or qualifying agent

specified in the application as satisfying the requirements of divisions

(A)(1) and (F)(1) of this section, to determine whether the applicant,

officer, or qualifying agent meets the requirements of division

(A)(1)(a) of this section. If the director determines that the

applicant, officer, or qualifying agent meets the requirements of

divisions (A)(1)(a), (b) and (d) of this section and that an officer or

qualifying agent meets the requirement of division (F)(1) of this

section, he shall notify the applicant, officer, or agent of the time

and place for the examination. If the director determines that an

applicant does not meet the requirements of divisions (A)(1)(a), (b),

and (d) of this section, he shall notify the applicant that his

application is refused and refund the license fee. If the director

determines that none of the individuals specified in the application of

a corporation as satisfying the requirements of divisions (A)(1) and

(F)(1) of this section meet the requirements of divisions (A)(1)(a),

(b), and (d) and (F)(1) of this section, he shall notify the corporation

that its application is refused and refund the license fee. If the

director requests an investigation of any applicant, officer, or

qualifying agent and if the bureau assesses the director a fee for the

investigation, the director, in addition to any other fee assessed

pursuant to this chapter, may assess the applicant, officer, or

qualifying agent, as appropriate, a fee that is equal to the fee

assessed by the bureau.



(D) If upon application, investigation, and examination, the director

finds that the applicant or, in the case of a corporation, any officer

or qualifying agent specified in the application as satisfying the

requirements of divisions (A)(1) and (F)(1) of this section, meets the

applicable requirements, he shall issue the applicant or the corporation

a class A, B, or C license. The director also shall issue to an

applicant, but not an officer or qualifying agent of a corporation, who

meets the applicable requirements an identification card. The license

and identification card shall state the licensee's name, the

classification of the license, the location of his principal place of

business in this state, and the expiration date of the license and, in

the case of a corporation, it also shall state the name of each officer

or qualifying agent who satisfied the requirements of divisions (A)(1)

and (F)(1) of this section. *61531 Licenses expire on the first day of

March following the date of initial issue, and on the first day of March

of each year thereafter. Renewals shall be according to the standard

renewal procedures contained in Chapter 4745. of the Revised Code, upon

payment of a renewal fee of two hundred fifty dollars. No license shall

be renewed if the licensee or, in the case of a corporation, each

officer or qualifying agent who qualified the corporation for licensure

no longer meets the applicable requirements of this section. No license

shall be renewed unless the licensee provides evidence of workers'

compensation risk coverage and unemployment compensation insurance

coverage, other than for clerical employees, as provided for in Chapters

4123. and 4141. of the Revised Code, respectively, as well as the

licensee's state tax identification number. No reexamination shall be

required for renewal of a current license.



For purposes of this chapter, a class A, B, or C license issued to a

corporation shall be considered as also having licensed the individuals

who qualified the corporation for licensure, for as long as they are

associated with the corporation.



(E) The director may issue a duplicate copy of a license issued under

this section for the purpose of replacement of a lost, spoliated, or

destroyed license, upon payment of a fee fixed by the director, not

exceeding twenty-five dollars. Any change in license classification

requires new application and application fees.



(F)(1) In order to qualify a corporation for a class A, B, or C license,

an officer or qualifying agent may qualify another corporation for

similar licensure, provided that he is actively engaged in the business

of both corporations.



(2) Each officer or qualifying agent who qualifies a corporation for

class A, B, or C licensure shall surrender any personal license of a

similar nature that he possesses.



(3) Upon written notification to the director, completion of an

application similar to that for original licensure, surrender of the

corporation's current license, and payment of a twenty-five dollar fee,

a corporation's class A, B, or C license may be transferred to another

corporation.



(4) Upon written notification to the director, completion of an

application similar to that for an individual seeking class A, B, or C

licensure, payment of a twenty-five dollar fee, and, if he was the only

individual that qualified a corporation for licensure, surrender of the

corporation's license, any officer or qualifying agent who qualified a

corporation for licensure under this chapter may obtain a similar

license in his own name without reexamination. A request by an officer

or qualifying agent for an individual license shall not affect a

corporation's license unless he is the only individual that qualified

the corporation for licensure or all the other individuals who qualified

the corporation for licensure submit such requests.



(G) If a corporation is for any reason no longer associated with an

individual who qualified it for licensure under this chapter, an officer

of the corporation shall notify the director of that fact by certified

mail, return receipt requested, within ten days after the association

terminates. If the notification is so given, the individual was the only

individual that qualified the corporation for licensure, and the

corporation submits the name of another officer or qualifying agent to

qualify the corporation for the license within thirty days after the

association terminates, the corporation may continue to operate in the

business of private investigation, the business of security services, or

both businesses in this state under that license for ninety days after

the association terminates. If the officer or qualifying agent whose

name is so submitted satisfies the requirements of divisions (A)(1) and

(F)(1) of this section, the director shall issue a new license to the

corporation within that ninety-day period. The names of more than one

individual may be so submitted.

[William R. Larson -]

Good question, Margie.

From looking at the information Legal Affairs posted, it is not necessary to hold a license under the exemptions listed. Otherwise you do need a license.

So, is it better to hold a license or not? Well, you have to make the call. If you can find sufficient work under the exemptions mentioned by Legal Affairs, you don't necessarily need to get it. If you want to solicit your own work, then yes, you do need a license. My personal opinion (which is only an opinion, and not factual) is if getting a license isn't a difficult task, you might was well get it.

One thing to check into if you do get it is what needs to be done to keep it current. I saw in another forum that you were moving next year. The Ohio PI license most likely will not follow you and be valid in your new state of residence. There are benefits to being licensed in other states, though. I'd check out what the requirements are to keep your license. Just like other licenses, this one can expire if you don't renew it.

[David Copeland]

Originally posted by Margie Bailey
If I were to hold a license in the state of ohio for PI would I be more likely to get jobs .....
"More" jobs than a trainee, and at a higher rate per hour.

[Margie Bailey]

Thank you, I have checked into the requirements for Ohios license and I may go ahead and get it. I also want to check out Missouri's license. I know they don't require it but for certain cities they do like St.Louis, which is where I'll be moving. In the forum where I read that it didn't have a link to Missouri's webpage, does anyone have that so I could check it out?
Margie Bailey,Ohio

[Stephen Bernhard]

Margie,

Youmight find this thread helpful also:

http://www.ipiu.org/forums//showthread.php?s=&threadid=1760

This thread is about concealed carry, but I have posted on there info that I have obtained from the Dept. of Commerce ref: PI license in Ohio.

Be safe,
Stephen

[Brett Deem -]

Margie,

This is my (personal) opinion since I can not find any legal reference at this time.

An important advantage to having a PI lincense in Ohio is that you would be pretty safe in representing yourself as an (independent) "Private Investigator" (outside of the 18 exemptions listed above in this topic).

(Otherwise, unless you were working for a law firm as a private investigator or working as a private investigator in one of the listed 18 exemptions), it would not be a good idea to represent yourself as a PI in Ohio unless you are licensed.

Another advantage is that you would be able to solicit and advertise yourself as a PI in Ohio and ultimately charge more.

This is just my opinion of what I have come across. Maybe Legal Affairs will jump in here.

Trying to help,

[Brett Deem -]

Originally posted by Kelly A Smith
I was wondering if having an Ohio Peace Officer Certification would give me any kind of advantage in the process of becoming a liscensed PI? I hold no commission with any department but I have my certification. Would this allow me to bypass any steps in the process? Can I use some of the hours earned gaining my certification towards anything in this area?

Thanks,
Kelly

Kelly,

I would think that your OPOTC would at least go towards Education on the PI License Application. Toward Experience I am not sure.
I would actually like to know, also. Since, I was thinking about going to the Police Academy.

[Brett Deem -]

Kelly,

Sorry, I cannot find a link for it.

But, you can call the Department of Commerce, Division of Real Estate & Professional Licensing at (614) 466-4130 and ask for a "Application Packet".

Or write to: Department of Commerce
Division of Real Estate & Professional Licensing
77 S. High Street, 20th Floor
Columbus, Ohio 43266-0546

Requesting they send you a "Application Packet."


Hope this helps.

[Legal Affairs]

Originally posted by Brett Deem
Margie,

This is my (personal) opinion since I can not find any legal reference at this time.

I have edited some small portions of your reply to comply with the exemptions stated in the first post in this topic.

Another point in the example I edited out is that no license is need to investigate anyone whatsoever, including a background check on a licensed physician. There is no license needed to represent yourself as a unlicensed private investigator in that pursuit, so long as you are working as an unlicensed private investigator for a law firm or for any other company listed in the eighteen (18) exemptions under state law. But you are correct in stating that a representation of an unlicensed private investigator to take on individual cases would require either a license or a business card that establishes the exemptions, such as the term "Case Examiner" implies.

You may wish to read our Mission Statement, as it was updated this year when there was doubt that IPIU supported regulating private investigators.

Link: http://www.ipiu.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2914

[Malcolm Rheuban]

Dear Legal Affairs:


From reading the list of exemptions to work without a license, am I clear, understanding that I would not be exempted, if I worked for someone in Security Services under their license?

"An employee in the regular course of the employee's employment, engaged in investigating matters pertinent to the business of his or her employer or protecting property in the possession of his or her employer, provided the employer is deducting all applicable state and federal employment taxes on behalf of the employee and neither the employer nor the employee is employed by, associated with, or acting for or on behalf of any private investigator or security guard provider;"


I had always thought it would be permissible to work for someone under their license; however, not only can't I find an exemption, but, it seems, I would be violating a code.

[Cynthia Ford]

Malcolm,

The exemption you quoted pertains to any business that hires you as an employee to investigate it's own interests.

The portion stating that the exemption does not apply to a privae investigator pertains to you being hired by a licensed private investigator or licensed security company, not working as a private investigator or a security officer for a business that employs you to work on it's own internal affairs.

Again, whenever the statute states "private investigator", it is referring to private investigators that are regulated by the state and not private investigators that are unregulated.

Another item is: If you are employed by a private investigative agency, you will not have to concern yourself with licensing matters. That will be the duty of your employer. And, as an employer, they may not have to license you under their agency for a number of reasons.

I recall reading about John Grogan (I believe it was John), who stated that (before he retired as a Calfornia PI) that he used his PI License to obtain business. But that a great deal of the business he obtained did not require the use of his license, such as acquiring basic court house documents, etc.

[Malcolm Rheuban]

Dear Cynthia,


First of all, Happy Mother's Day!.

Secondly, I understand, now, that the exemption I quoted applies to another situation, like a shady, unethical business competing covertly against another.

Thirdly, I see where the Law says a person is exempt if he/she is working for an attorney," Attorneys at law or any expert hired by an attorney at law for consultation or litigation purposes;
"; however, I do not see the Law stating any exemptions for a person doing investigative work under the license of an agency.

Although I think you are absolutely right, "If you are employed by a private investigative agency, you will not have to concern yourself with licensing matters. That will be the duty of your employer.", do you know, off hand, of any documentation a person could gather to demonstrate to an agency to support the claim that he/she could legally perform duties for them?

Additionally, thanks for taking the time to respond to my uncertainty.

P.S. Save yourself any extra effort on my account. I found what I was looking for in writing. Under 4749.13 Prohibitions
"Nothing in this chapter shall be construed to require any employee of a class A, B, or C licensee to obtain a class A, B, or C license, provided that an employee shall be registered by an licensee when required by section 4749.03 of the Revised Code."
There is more to read; however, as you stated, he/she could work for an agency and it is the agency's responsibility to register all their employees.

[Malcolm Rheuban]

Dear Legal Affairs:

There is a section concerning the formal registration of employees under Ohio Law for Private Investigators:

1301:4-5-11 Registration of employees
(A) Each licensee shall register his investigator and security guard employees with the department of commerce.
(B) Each licensee shall file an application to register a new investigator or security guard employee with the department of commerce no later than seven business days after the employee's name is posted on the licensee's payroll records. The licensee must post any employee's name on the licensee's payroll records before that employee works any assignment for the licensee. The licensee must submit, on forms provided by the department, verification of the employee's name, date of birth, and social security number as well as one readable set of fingerprints of the employee to be registered.
(C) Within ten business days after the termination of a registrant's employment, the licensee shall notify the department of commerce on forms provided by the department of such termination, and submit the registrant's identification card for cancellation.
(D) For purposes of this rule, "business day" does not include Saturday or Sunday. Filings postmarked on the applicable business day shall be considered to have been timely filed.
HISTORY: Eff 1-1-70; 8-10-89 Rule promulgated under: RC 119.03 Rule authorized by: RC 4749.02 Rule amplifies: RC 4749.06

My question is, if a person were to obtain work experience as a student from an investigator, like the mentorship Education Direct encourages, would he/she have to formally register with the Department of Commerce in the state of Ohio to perform investigative duties, providing he /she was not on the payroll?

[Mary Lynn Warner]

Originally posted by Malcolm Rheuban
My question is, if a person were to obtain work experience as a student from an investigator, like the mentorship Education Direct encourages, would he/she have to formally register with the Department of Commerce in the state of Ohio to perform investigative duties, providing he /she was not on the payroll?
Not unless the employer were a "licensee", which means an agency that both receives a state PI license and is conducting assignments that require a license.

Some agencies use their PI license to advertise to obtain assignments that do not require a PI license. And if they have an employee working a non-regulated assignment, then there is no requirement.

Whenever you read a statute that says "licensee", that means a company or person who is required to have a license and whose assignments require a license.

[Malcolm Rheuban]

Dear Mary Lynn,

Thanks for the response. My state, Ohio, seems rigorous compared to other states in regulating P.I. work. The Department of Commerce, Division of Real Estate and Professional Licensing is the controlling body. When I called them to ask the same question, they replied that whatever I do, I have to put it in writing and mail it to their legal department.

Another part of this law that is unclear to me are the exemptions to having to be registered to work with insurance people. I am not sure if I understand the difference between:

Certified public insurance adjusters that hold a certificate of authority issued pursuant to sections 3951.01 to 3951.09 of the Revised Code, while the adjuster is investigating the cause of or responsibility for a fire, accident, or other damage to property with respect to a claim or claims for loss or damage under a policy of insurance covering real or personal property;


And An independent insurance adjuster who, as an individual, an independent contractor, an employee of an independent contractor, adjustment bureau association, corporation, insurer, partnership, local recording agent, managing general agent, or self-insurer, engages in the business of independent insurance adjustment, or any person who supervises the handling of claims except while acting as an employee of an insurer licensed in this state while handling claims pertaining to specific policies written by that insurer.

Would I be legal going to an insurance agent and seeing if I could do some investigative work for him/her?

Thanks again for trying to explain these legal terms in layman's terms. I think I should know the legal ramifications of what I am getting into, before I get into anything.

[Amber Djukic]

Originally posted by Malcolm Rheuban
[however, I do not see the Law stating any exemptions for a person doing investigative work under the license of an agency.
Although I think you are absolutely right, "If you are employed by a private investigative agency, you will not have to concern yourself with licensing matters. That will be the duty of your employer.", do you know, off hand, of any documentation a person could gather to demonstrate to an agency to support the claim that he/she could legally perform duties for them?


Malcolm,
In the initial material I received from IPIU, there was a section that stated a P.I. trainee was not required to have an individual license if employed by an agency with a license. I hope I read this accurately, since it was one deciding factor in my becoming a trainee!
Amber D.:)

[Robert Donovan]

Originally posted by Neal Naughton
My crazy question is this: If I'm thinking working for myself as a PI and the State of Ohio requires two years of experience, what constitutes two years? Is it 24 months which is 17,520 hours long, or is it 516 working days, or...?

Exactly what is meant by 2 years experience? --NFN
Go to the Licensing Forum for PI's, and post your question in the OHIO Licensing topic. :)

[Legal Affairs]

Originally posted by Amber Djukic
...stated a P.I. trainee was not required to have an individual license if employed by an agency with a license. I hope I read this accurately, since it was one deciding factor in my becoming a trainee!
Amber D.:)
Please read the first comment posted in this Topic. It contains a list of 18 EXEMPTIONS for private investigators that do not need a separate private investigators license from Ohio. Some of those exemptions include types of firms and agencys (such as law firms that hire private investigators) whereby the PI works under their professional license.

[Jim Ley--]

Neal,

Florida requires two years experience and it equates to 4,000 hours. That's 40 hours per week, 50 weeks per year for two years.

Jim

[Shawn D Spaulding]

Is there a general license you could get to cover all or most of the USA? Just a matter of keeping one's options open.

Shawn Spaulding

[B Ann Craig]

Richard,
On January 19, you posted this thread. Did you receive your credentials? How long after your sent your prints and picture in, did you receive them? :confused:

Thanks for the info!

Julie Mercer
Julie, Richard has been at level 4 for some time now. ;)

Have a wonderful week. Take care. :)

[Julie Mercer -]

B Ann,
Thanks for the information! It is great to hear about people excelling, it is encouraging! :D

Julie Mercer

[B Ann Craig]

Julie, you are very welcome. ;)

Have a wonderful week. Take care. :)

[Keith Milligan]

It states you need 4000 hours of experience or education; I am currently employed by the Juvenile court which IS a government agency. I've been there for 2 years, and I'm in my second year of a 2 year degree in criminal justice. Would these meet the requirements for experience and/or education in order to recieve a license?

Thanks in advance for the information

[Julie Mercer -]

It states you need 4000 hours of experience or education; I am currently employed by the Juvenile court which IS a government agency. I've been there for 2 years, and I'm in my second year of a 2 year degree in criminal justice. Would these meet the requirements for experience and/or education in order to recieve a license?
Keith,
The experience and education is an excellent background. But, unfortunately the education isn't part of the criteria to get your license. Unless your work experience was working under a Licensed Private Investigator or firm, that won't qualify you either. Post #1 is very informative & I think will also help answer your question. :)
Julie

[DJ Moran]

Okay, let me see how confused I am?! :eek: Now, As long as I work as a trainee,( assignments) I would be covered under who I work for. :eek: ;) :confused: Maybe with the on the job training, I will have a clearer picture of the rules. This is so new to me, and frankly, I feel having a licenses, will protect me from, doing something that is wrong. However, if I need 2 years or 4000 hours of expereince,to apply for a licenses, then I think I have a ways to go, before worrying too much about it, and as I said, Maybe with the on the job training provided, I will learn the laws of the licenses , to make a better informed decision. :) Thanks for the information shared here, and I will check in later for more information on this topic. :) ;) "DJ"

[Rebecca Boyle-]

How do I go about obtaining an Ohio license and getting started in this type of work? I am not sure where to begin. Thanks for your help.
Rebecca Boyle

[Paul Shuman]

How do I go about obtaining an Ohio license and getting started in this type of work? I am not sure where to begin. Thanks for your help.
Rebecca Boyle

Rebecca (and Fellow Ohio Trainees) -

Here's some info you may find helpful:

PI's are now regulated by the Ohio Department of Homeland Security. Information is available at http://www.homelandsecurity.ohio.gov/pisg.htm.

If you are looking to set up a business as a PI, visit the Ohio First Stop Business Connection website at http://www.odod.state.oh.us/onestop/. Follow the instructions to get all the documents you'll need to start the process of building your business. When asked for the type of business, search "Private Investigator" to get the right docs.

(These sites can be accessed from the homepage at http://ohio.gov/.)

A PI trainee is not defined in the statute as far as I can tell, but employees of licensed PI's or PI Corporations are well defined. Furthermore, the statute does not address unlicensed independent contractors. The focus is on licensed PI's and their employees. Having read this, I won't even begin to pretend I understand the extent of the regulations regarding PI trainees and employee status vs. independent contractor. Thus, my questions!

The definition of the business of Private Investigation is broadly written, and the exemptions (in contrast) are narrowly defined. These regulations, by my read, strictly limit the type and scope of work an unlicensed PI can do. The other side of the coin is that you have to have 4000 hours of experience in the two years immediately preceding license application, or an applicable degree and 2000 hours in the preceding year. To get a license, you have to have full-time trainee experience, so obviously unlicensed PI work is allowed under the statute.

How does one go about being an unlicensed trainee when it reads as if a license is just about always required, unless you meet the narrowly defined exemptions? Do you have to be an employee as a trainee or can you be independent? In other words, what exactly are the circumstances that one can gain experience as a PI, without being licensed in Ohio, in order to get licensed in Ohio?

Regarding the required experience, at some point (if you want to be licensed in Ohio) you have to work full-time as a PI trainee. Is there any flexibility in the experience requirement if you are full-time in some other profession not related to law enforcement or investigation and still want to be licensed (for example, getting the hours over a greater number of years)?

Hope the websites help, and thanks for any further info you, or anyone else, may have.

[Barbara Starr -]

Joe, your points are well taken. I went to the websites you referred to and read the requirements surrounding what is required to be licensed or even to do P.I. work. I agree with you that the assignments that an Ohio resident can do without a license are extremely limited (if any). I also agree that surely we must be able to do something or how does one obtain the 2000 hours of experience??? If any of you seasoned members, particularly from Ohio, can shed some light on this it would be most helpful.

[Paul Shuman]

Barbara -

Thanks for the response. I finally got someone to "talk" to me!

Some further reading in the maze of forums revealed what I think is one answer. The Ohio statute defines a Licensed PI as on who does the work "for hire." Apparently, the meaning of this is that you need a license in order to solicit work from a client as a PI or PI agency. A "trainee" on the other hand, doesn't go looking for clients, but works for someone else who has the contact with the client.

NO guarantees this is the right interpretation for Ohio, but it's a thought.

Still can't get around the whole employee/contractor issue.

Take care and good luck!

[SCOTT NAPIER]

Hello, I have a question and wanted to see if I can get some help in the area, I have taken a course work for a diploma in Private Investigation at thompson direct education, will this help me by pass any testing and move me forward to becoming independent PI

[Michelle Adams]

Hello everyone from Ohio. Thank you so much for posting the information regarding Ohio Licensing. ;)

I have called the state office myself several times, but it seems no one can give you a STRAIGHT answer when you ask them complexed questions. :mad:

I do know this, I worked for a few law firms and did all of the skip tracing, collections, surveillance or research field work. It was explained to me by my employer at that time, that I was his private company :cool: PI. I enjoyed the work so much, I wanted to persue my career back then to obtain my license, but couldn't because of personal reasons. Now that I have the extra time, I'm a little more seasoned with the smarts & talent, I felt I needed more training, more connections, and I am hoping to become a Licensed PI within the next year. :D

If you have any tips for this trainee, PLEASE share.
Regards, Michelle :)

[Paul Shuman]

I worked for a few law firms and did all of the skip tracing, collections, surveillance or research field work. It was explained to me by my employer at that time, that I was his private company :cool: PI.

Michelle -

Hi and welcome! I'm still full of questions, but not so much about getting licensed as I am the legality of working without a license in Ohio.

The situation you describe above is pretty clear in the exceptions to licensure in the Ohio Revised Code. Do you have any experience working as an independent contractor and doing the same type of work?

Thanks and good luck!

[Michelle Adams]

Hi Joe - In response to your question, I was always an employee of the firm or company, not a sub-contractor. Although, I DO want to be a subcontractor, it leaves my door open for opportunities new and old within the industry. Let's hope the pay is worth it.

My current interest is in the field of finding people, skip tracing, surveillance for fraud, marital and I will see at a later date what else interests me. But for now, this is what I know, what I am good at and the current experience I have to share, not to mention having worked within the security alarm industry in sales. As my family and friends say "I'm a people watcher!"

PI work has always been my passion as a child. As an adult, I've always been the problem solver. The more difficult, the better. When I was in the legal field, let's just say, I was always the top performer in solving any mysteries or was the one who busted the individual doing wrong.

So by joining IPIU, I am hoping to follow a life long passion. Being the secret squirrel I was born to be!

Good luck to you Joe and I hope to see you around in the forums. Keep me posted on your progress there Buckeye. :)

[Michelle Adams]

Hello, I have a question and wanted to see if I can get some help in the area, I have taken a course work for a diploma in Private Investigation at thompson direct education, will this help me by pass any testing and move me forward to becoming independent PI


Hi Scott & Welcome.
In response to your question, I'm not sure, :confused: but maybe someone out here can give you the answer or point you in the right direction.

May I ask what class or course did you take? What are they teaching you or what have your learned.

Me personally, I have looked into a few of the schools, but they just didn't make enough sence on what they were actually going to teach me. In my personal opinion, I believe the best experience is on-the-job training, observing and learning from others. Then taking courses at a credited college to know the laws or any other field you are interested in. But in the field my friend and in these forums is where you will hear, read and learn the techniques from other qualified PIs. There were too many questions unanswered by the schools I spoke to. :( That's why I chose IPIU and I am also attending classes for my future. :D

Best regards and I hope I helped. Good luck Scott! :D ;)

[Paul Shuman]

Hello all my fellow Ohioans. I’ve been doing some research . . .

I know this is a very long post, and I’m hoping to get some good feedback out of it. If you have the interest, bear with me and read on!




Beginning of the DISCLAIMER

I am not a lawyer. I don’t even play one on TV. What I have done for longer than I care to remember is interpret and implement various hazardous materials (hazmat) regulations in the commercial and government sectors. My evaluation of the Ohio code and regulations regarding PI licensing is based on my experience in regulatory research and interpretation in the aforementioned area of expertise. Therefore, the following is provided as furthering the discussion, and not as authoritative guidance.

If you want to know more about me: http://www.ipiu.org/forums/showthread.php?t=19151

End of the DISCLAIMER



If you’re still with me, let’s go. If you’re not, then you’re not reading this, but I have to say I can’t blame you . . .

The regulatory analysis that I have performed in hazmat management begins with a simple question: If I pursue a certain course of action, will I get in trouble? Let’s apply this to the Ohio PI Licensing discussion rephrase the question: If I do some type of investigative work in Ohio and I am not a licensed PI, will I get into trouble? I think we should use examples as a framework for the discussion. However, before I give you examples pertinent to our discussion here, let me define trouble – getting hurt, hurting someone else, getting fired, getting fined, going to jail. Got the point? Good, let’s move on . . .

[Paul Shuman]

Example 1: Your best friend knows you are trying to become a PI in Ohio. She just me a new guy, really likes him, but wants to be careful and “check him out.” Knowing that you know something about this, she asks you for help. You are not a licensed PI. The question: If you help her, will you get in trouble?

Example 2: You are working as an employee for a Licensed PI firm. The client is someone you don’t know, and has come to the firm for the same reasons as in example #1. The PI in charge of the case assigns it to you with instructions on what they want as the scope of the investigation.

Example 3: Same as #2, however, you are an independent contractor.

Example 4: You are not licensed. You take out an ad that says “I’m a PI!” Your phone rings. Your client is the guy dating the woman in the above examples and wants her checked out. You give him a price, he says O.K., and off you go.

[Paul Shuman]

What are the answers? Let’s read the regulations:

Ohio Revised Code 4749.01
Definitions
As used in this chapter:
(A) "Private investigator" means any person who engages in the business of private investigation.
(B) "Business of private investigation" means, except when performed by one excluded under division (H) of this section, the conducting, for hire, in person or through a partner or employees, of any investigation relevant to any crime or wrong done or threatened, or to obtain information on the identity, habits, conduct, movements, whereabouts, affiliations, transactions, reputation, credibility, or character of any person, or to locate and recover lost or stolen property, or to determine the cause of or responsibility for any libel or slander, or any fire, accident, or damage to property, or to secure evidence for use in any legislative, administrative, or judicial investigation or proceeding.

Your first reaction is to say “Look at division (H) and see if I fall into one of the exempt categories.” Good, that’s what you should do, and you did, and your not, so what’s next?

Let’s look at this again – a PI in Ohio is one who “engages in the business of private investigation.” In other words, if you are not in the business, you are not a PI, and you’re out of the regulations. This is important, so let me say it another way – in order to be bound by the regulations, the regulations have to define you as being within the scope. If you don’t fall within the defined scope, you are outside the regulatory jurisdiction, and you are free to pursue your dreams. (Unless, of course, there’s another regulation binding you, but as far as I can tell ORC 4749 and OAC 1301:5-4, which we’ll get to in a minute, is all you got.)

The question now is whether you are engaged in the business of private investigation, which is the purpose of 4749.01(B) above. Cut to the chase – remember, the exceptions don’t apply for our discussion - the code explicitly says “for hire.” What’s that mean? Hire (noun), compensation for the use of a thing, or for labor or service (Black’s Law Dictionary). So, a PI in Ohio is engaged in the business when they do PI work for compensation.

Sounds like all of us. I certainly don’t work for free. But, wait a minute, what’s compensation? Black’s again – “remuneration for services rendered, whether in salary, fees, or commissions.” Remuneration? “Payment, reimbursement, reward, recompense, salary, compensation.” Compensation? Didn’t we start there? Gotta love that Black’s Law Dictionary!!

[Paul Shuman]

So let’s go back to the examples. Here’s my opinion on Example 1: If you do a public records check on the Internet, give her the results, and she pays you for the cost of the search and buys you a six-pack, what’s the crime? You did something anyone can do, and she simply showed her appreciation. You did not solicit her through advertising or by hanging a sign on your door, she didn’t call you because of an ad in the yellow pages or a flier, and you have never said you were a PI in the state of Ohio. You did a favor, she said thanks, get over your bad self and have a brew.

How about the rest of the examples? In 2 & 3 I hope you expect compensation. In #4 you better expect compensation. So you’re a PI in Ohio and you need a license, right? Well, let’s do a little more research.

[Paul Shuman]

The code defines employees! 4749.01(I): "Employee" means every person who may be required or directed by any employer, in consideration of direct or indirect gain or profit, to engage in any employment, or to go, or work, or be at any time in any place of employment, provided that the employer of the employee deducts all applicable state and federal employment taxes on behalf of the employee.

In Example 2 you are an employee. Division (B) contains the language “the conducting, for hire, in person or through a partner or employees . . .” So, the licensed firm conducts, for compensation, PI work, through you, as an employee. (In case you haven’t noticed, I’m an artist with commas. Annoying, ain’t it?) Done! Your covered by the regs and don’t need a license. You can do whatever area of PI work your employer assigns you since they are the party with the license, the firm is for hire, and you work as an employee through their license. Example 2 is a good deal. Open another brew. (There are some employee registration requirements I won’t get into here, but for now just remember I noted this.)

Let’s increase the comfort level on this one, and look at a notation in OAC 1301:4-5. (Gotta tell you something here – you won’t find this notation in the stuff posted at the OH Homeland Security PI page, you have to go to the “officially” published code.) This is what it says after Section 08, Required Experience: “1. (1994) The licensing scheme under RC Chapter 4749 requires only the head of the business to be licensed. The licensee’s employees need only register with the department of commerce.” This is what I like to call a regulatory gem – lays it out in plain language!

Example 3 complicates the issue by making you an independent contractor. My answer is: So what? It actually makes the issue less complicated! Let’s read it again: “the conducting, for hire, in person or through a partner or employees . . .” Doesn’t say independent contractors. Remember what I said so long ago - if you don’t meet the definitions, you are outside the regulatory jurisdiction, and you are free to pursue your dreams. Not defined, not regulated, go to work and when you’re done – that’s right – get your remuneration and break into one more brew. Good for the licensed PI firm, too, they don’t have to register you!

By now you should see without further discussion that Example 4 will land you in court, when (not IF) you get turned into the OH Division of Homeland Security, where Licensed PI’s are now regulated. No more brew for you, at least until you make parole . . .

[Paul Shuman]

Now, at no additional cost, the big HOWEVER. One of the rules in hazmat management is that you never really know you’re doing the right thing until someone of authority tells you you’re not in compliance. Same thing applies to the OH PI regs. Somebody in a position of authority may eventually decide what the regulation really means, and then sanction someone (or a bunch of someones) who are not in compliance with the now “official” interpretation. How is it resolved? You guessed it, it’s called a hearing, a trial, your day in court. So, one additional element to this analysis is to search the court records and see if there have been any challenges that affect an interpretation of the rules and regulations pertinent to our discussion.

I didn’t find a single one. That’s not to say there isn’t, but I didn’t come across it. (I did find one case where an unlicensed PI from another state was an Expert Witness in a trial in Ohio, and the opposing counsel challenged his standing as an expert without a license. The decision? The regulation doesn’t require an out-of-state PI to have a license in order to testify in court. If the regulation doesn’t bring you into its scope, do your thing!)

Just for my safety, one more time . . .




Beginning of the DISCLAIMER

I am not a lawyer. I don’t even play one on TV. What I have done for longer than I care to remember is interpret and implement various hazardous materials (hazmat) regulations in the commercial and government sectors. My evaluation of the Ohio code and regulations regarding PI licensing is based on my experience in regulatory research and interpretation in the aforementioned area of expertise. Therefore, the following is provided as furthering the discussion, and not as authoritative guidance.

If you want to know more about me: http://www.ipiu.org/forums/showthread.php?t=19151

End of the DISCLAIMER



That’s my conclusion, so don’t worry ‘bout it. By my count you got three beers left. Have one and let me know where I'm w-r-o-n-g.

Thanks for listening!

[Paul Shuman]

Although it may not be violative of the law:




Example 3 complicates the issue by making you an independent contractor. My answer is: So what? It actually makes the issue less complicated! Let’s read it again: “the conducting, for hire, in person or through a partner or employees . . .” Doesn’t say independent contractors. Remember what I said so long ago - if you don’t meet the definitions, you are outside the regulatory jurisdiction, and you are free to pursue your dreams. Not defined, not regulated, go to work and when you’re done – that’s right – get your remuneration and break into one more brew. Good for the licensed PI firm, too, they don’t have to register you!



I have definitely changed my mind:


Hello Members,
I would like to put my 2 cents in on this topic as an agency owner in Indiana. I only sub-contract out to other licensed agencies. If I hire you under my license your are an employee of my agency I withhold taxes(which I have to match) You are covered under my insurance, I pay for your workmans comp. if you use your vehical you are covered under my insurance, if you use a company car your still covered. As an employee you are not paid $40 to $75 an hour. You are paid an hourly rate ,overtime after 40hrs. As being licensed under me you can not work for yourself as a licensed Private Investigator because you are granted a license by me to do my Investigations.
Should a person try and do so I will take away his license and will send a form to the Department of Licensing and this will make it very hard for you to ever apply and get your own license when you are quailified to do so. This is the way that I do business at my agency.

Good Luck to all,
David

(David Martz's comment orginally posted in the thread PI Agency Insurance: Cheap?)

I realize this is based on Indiana law, however, note that the individual will only subcontract out to licensed agencies, and draws a clear line between subcontracting as a Licensed Independent Contractor and employees.

My gut feeling is that working as an unlicensed Independent is asking for trouble, no matter what the law says (or doesn't say).

Just my (reevaluated) opinion.

[Leonard Chenault]

My input on this is, make it simple and as you acquire your enjoyable hours toward your licensing the knowledge you get as you progress will qualifie you to be all you can be!!!!! I think it is better to have than not have????? I want mind now thanks for the sharing of information.
asap Leonard

[DJ Moran]

Are we all not covered under working for IPIU? Thought this is why the training and assignments were being offered through IPIU!! I am not ready to start my own business of this type, and will continue to learn as much as possible, before applying for a licenses in the state of Ohio. Maybe I will relocate,when ready to start my own business?? For now, thanks for the information, even though I may not completely understand all of it,It is something to research on my own, and find even more answers.I think I would probably try to work for a PI firm, or law firm, before starting my own business anyway. Being unsure of what all avenues, I want to develope in this field,There are sooooo many) I think I will be patient and get the hours needed, in the event, I want to go out on my own, Thanks for sharing all the information, "DJ"

[Paul Shuman]

Are we all not covered under working for IPIU? Thought this is why the training and assignments were being offered through IPIU!! I am not ready to start my own business of this type, and will continue to learn as much as possible, before applying for a licenses in the state of Ohio. Maybe I will relocate,when ready to start my own business?? For now, thanks for the information, even though I may not completely understand all of it,It is something to research on my own, and find even more answers.I think I would probably try to work for a PI firm, or law firm, before starting my own business anyway. Being unsure of what all avenues, I want to develope in this field,There are sooooo many) I think I will be patient and get the hours needed, in the event, I want to go out on my own, Thanks for sharing all the information, "DJ"

DJ -

First, read the up to date info for Ohio at the official Ohio website. From an earlier post of mine:



PI's are now regulated by the Ohio Department of Homeland Security. Information is available at http://www.homelandsecurity.ohio.gov/pisg.htm.

If you are looking to set up a business as a PI, visit the Ohio First Stop Business Connection website at http://www.odod.state.oh.us/onestop/. Follow the instructions to get all the documents you'll need to start the process of building your business. When asked for the type of business, search "Private Investigator" to get the right docs.

(These sites can be accessed from the homepage at http://ohio.gov/.)



Second, here's a bunch more of my opinions having been here for a couple more months:

For Anti-Piracy, I think what happens there is that we fall under one of the exemptions because we are actually working under the auspices of an attorney's office.

For Integrity Investigations, I think this type of activity does not meet the regulatory definition of PI.

If you read the statute and find that it is unclear, you may try to get an explanation of what the law really means from the Ohio Department of Homeland Security. I wish you good luck if you take this path. I had no luck.

Something to consider, and I'm not doing anything here but stating a fact: As far as I know, IPIU is not a registered business entity (in the legal sense) in the state of Ohio, and is not licensed as a PI firm in the state of Ohio. In that case, you are not "covered" in any sense when doing work through IPIU. If the work is clearly under the exemptions or outside the regulatory bounds, then fine. Otherwise, you have to look at the law and decide on a risk-v-benefit basis if what you are doing is within the scope of the law. Being a resident of Ohio, it's between you and the laws of your state.

One more point - in other threads where I have had related discussions, licensed PI's from other states have made one thing clear: if they need PI work done in Ohio, they will only request it through a Licensed PI or PI Firm.

My bottom line: IPIU is a great resource, but has no bearing on my decisions to pursue PI activities under the laws of the state of Ohio. Some may disagree, but this is my working position given all that I have been able to digest since I joined.

[Jeffrey Roemer]

DJ,

My name is Jeffrey Roemer, and I am the President/CEO of Intelquest Investigations in Dayton, OH. If you are requesting to work for an agency in Ohio, we may be able to help you. It is legal for you to work as an investigator under our license, and build the investigative experience you need to acquire an Ohio Private Investigator's License. If we can be of any help to you, please feel free to email me at jsroemer@intelquestinvestigations.com

Take Care & Happy Holidays
Jeff

[Paul Shuman]

DJ,

My name is Jeffrey Roemer, and I am the President/CEO of Intelquest Investigations in Dayton, OH. If you are requesting to work for an agency in Ohio, we may be able to help you. It is legal for you to work as an investigator under our license, and build the investigative experience you need to acquire an Ohio Private Investigator's License. If we can be of any help to you, please feel free to email me at jsroemer@intelquestinvestigations.com

Take Care & Happy Holidays
Jeff

Jeff -

Thanks for the reply. I appreciate the input regarding working under a firm's license.

As you may have read, the question I was dealing with early on was the issue of working independently and unlicensed. Although there are exceptions, they seem to me to be limited in scope. Therein lay my early discomfort.

The ideal situation for any trainee would be to either work for a licensed firm/individual, or a job that falls into the exemptions, in order to get the requisite experience to become licensed. Right now, I'm good with what I'm pursuing, but certainly other trainees in Ohio would benefit from your assistance.

Thanks again.

[DJ Moran]

DJ,

My name is Jeffrey Roemer, and I am the President/CEO of Intelquest Investigations in Dayton, OH. If you are requesting to work for an agency in Ohio, we may be able to help you. It is legal for you to work as an investigator under our license, and build the investigative experience you need to acquire an Ohio Private Investigator's License. If we can be of any help to you, please feel free to email me at jsroemer@intelquestinvestigations.com

Take Care & Happy Holidays
Jeff
Dear Mr. Roemer,
First and Foremost, Thank you!! I will be contacting you and forwarding my resume to you at the e-mail address your have provided. I appreciate your interest in helping me, in any way posssible. Thanks again, and I hope to hear from you, after you have had time to review my resume.And ,You and your family have a " Wonderful and Safe" Holiday. Sincerely, ""DJ"

[Nyoka Holmes -]

Hello out there! I was wondering, once I have mailed and passed the test how long it would take for me to recieve information on employment from IPIU? Also, what are some of the benifits of being @ a level 1?

[DJ Moran]

Hello out there! I was wondering, once I have mailed and passed the test how long it would take for me to recieve information on employment from IPIU? Also, what are some of the benifits of being @ a level 1?
Nyoka, Please ask your questions in the Introduction Lounge, so the moderators can better direct you in finding answers to questions you may have.
Click on this link
Forum Member Introduction's Lounge!

Have you posted your Agreement to our Code of Ethics yet?
If not, click on the following link, read it, and then post a Quick Reply that you agree:

CODE OF ETHICS (http://www.ipiu.org/forums/showthread.php?t=6688


Here is another good link, A place to start
Newcomer? Do this FIRST!
Here is another link for you too:
If you just can't figure out which forum to post a new topic, do so in the Click here:After Hours Lounge Forum
And, Welcome to IPIU, Good Luck in your new adventures, "DJ"

[Dallas Rose]

Hello to All, My question is -Who do I contact for licensing information in Ks? Is there a Web site that lists all 50 States requirements? Thanks for any Help available. Dallas

[DJ Moran]

Hello to All, My question is -Who do I contact for licensing information in Ks? Is there a Web site that lists all 50 States requirements? Thanks for any Help available. Dallas

Dallas, I do not know if the wesite below will help you in the information you need concerning KS. However, In the Licenses Law Forum there are many topics for each state. If the website is not helpful, then go to the Licenses Law Forum and read the topics for your state.


05-13-2003, 02:01 PM
Michael Briley
Link - https://www.accesskansas.org/kbi/pi...lpfulhints.html




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Donna Reagan]

Hello out there! I was wondering, once I have mailed and passed the test how long it would take for me to recieve information on employment from IPIU? Also, what are some of the benifits of being @ a level 1?
Nkoka,

If you have general questions and cannot locate the proper topic or forum, please post your question by authoring your Introduction Topic where the trainers and other moderators can guide you.

In order to do so, please click on the following Newcomer's link and perform Instructions #2 and #3:

http://www.ipiu.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5008

[Greg Moeller--]

Thank you Joe,great info...

[Dale Papes -]

Look, in simple, plain English- not O.R.C "blah balh blah", if you have opotc security certification; are not working as a p.i; what do you need to do to get your p.i license in Ohio? And the packet they send from Ohio doesnt answer anything in plain English. What would one do to get licensed on their own - can they?

[Jessica Starnes]

Hi! I am new to this, however I am very interested in obtaining my PI license in Ohio. I'm not quite sure where to start. I did order an application, is that all I need to do for right now? Thanks for any input..

[Technical Support]

Look, in simple, plain English- not O.R.C "blah balh blah", if you have opotc security certification; are not working as a p.i; what do you need to do to get your p.i license in Ohio? And the packet they send from Ohio doesnt answer anything in plain English. What would one do to get licensed on their own - can they?
Please read Page 1 of this topic that was posted by Legal Affairs. Pay attention to the section titled NO LICENSE NEEDED as a private investigator.

Second, read further in the page that gives you the requirements you are seeking.

Third, if you still need help, go back to the packet you received and call their office.

Here is the link:
http://www.ipiu.org/forums/showthread.php?t=2476&page=1&pp=30

[Jessica Starnes]

Thank you. That clears up a lot.

[Korey S Whitmore]

Hello, I am new to the forum and have a question about Ohio laws. I currently have my Security Guard state license in Ohio. Since I already hold this license are the steps to being licensed as a private investigator any different?

[Robert A Smith]

Rebecca (and Fellow Ohio Trainees) -

Here's some info you may find helpful:

THANK YOU JOE! This really puts things in a unique perspective and was just the type of thing I was looking for!
:D

Bob

[Shawn Atkinson -]

Thanks Joe for all of your input. This thread has been very educational.

Congratulations D.J. on the opportunity given to you by Mr. Roemer! I'm sure everything went well.

Shawn

[Richard M Jackson Sr -]

Hello, I am somewhat new to these forums. However, as a Licensed Ohio Private Investigator, I am compelled to bring everyone up to date on this issue. As September 4, 2004, ALL Private Investigators and Security Guard Providers are under the umbrella of the Ohio Department of Public Safety through the Office of Homeland Security. Having said that, there are a number of changes taking affect to the laws of licensing of each. Now, I have read some of the post in this forum talking about doing work for private clients that fall outside the realm of the current law. THAT IS BEING CHANGED!!! No longer will businesses and individuals be able to perform this work without being licensed. I for one, totaly agree with this. As a member of OASIS, which is the reconized professional organization of private investigators and security gaurd providers in the state of Ohio, a close watch will be placed in the industry to seek out and prosecute those who are practicing investigations without a license. Currently, the Director of Homeland Security has prosecuted 6 individuals within the last few weeks for such a thing and he states he will keep doing so until EVERYONE knows that you MUST HAVE A LICENSE TO PRACTICE INVESTIGATIONS IN OHIO, with only a few of the 18 exceptions that you saw listed above.

The exceptions that most likely will remain will be "engaged in the practice of law" or working for someone who is. It is still a toss up regarding "Independent Insurance Adjusters". However, "Process Servers" and "Background Checks" will more than likely be gone within the next year or so. The jury is still out on the others. Basicly, just as the attorneys have the lock down on the practice of law, investigators are starting to do the same. Also, the Director of Homeland Security has hired investigators to work for his office in each of the 88 counties in Ohio to investigate any and all companies currently practicing "Process Serving and Background Checks" to advise them of the need to get licensed within the next year or so. He is also letting them know that if they don't, they will be prosecuted.

[Richard M Jackson Sr -]

Please keep in mind that just because you are able to work for an attorney as a private investigator, you are not. You may be hired and tell others that you are a investigator with what ever firm you are with, but you CAN NOT STATE THAT YOU ARE A PRIVATE INVESTIGATOR. Furthermore, you cannot do work for anyone outside of the attorney's office and any work you do there, you are doing it as your normal course of business for a specific case that the attorney has. This means that you cannot go out and solicit business for yourself and then bring the person to the firm for the legal side of the case. This would be a violation of law as well as the attorney vicariously violating one of the cannons of ethics.

[Richard M Jackson Sr -]

No! The state of Ohio will only give consideration for a degree either Associates in Private Investigations, Law Enforcement, Criminal Justice, or Paralegal and of course, they will give consideration to a Bachelor degree in any subject. As for the consideration, the state will take away 1/2 of the experience requirment should you meet the aforementioned education. Therefore, for the Class A, they will take away 750 hours of the patrol time and 750 hours of the investigative time needed; for the Class B, they will take away 1,000 hours of the investigative time; and for the Class C, they will take away 1,500 hours of the patrol time.

[Robert A Smith]

The exceptions that most likely will remain will be "engaged in the practice of law" or working for someone who is. It is still a toss up regarding "Independent Insurance Adjusters". However, "Process Servers" and "Background Checks" will more than likely be gone within the next year or so. The jury is still out on the others. Basicly, just as the attorneys have the lock down on the practice of law, investigators are starting to do the same. Also, the Director of Homeland Security has hired investigators to work for his office in each of the 88 counties in Ohio to investigate any and all companies currently practicing "Process Serving and Background Checks" to advise them of the need to get licensed within the next year or so. He is also letting them know that if they don't, they will be prosecuted.

Richard,

So how will this effect those of us just starting out as trainees in Ohio in your opinion? I know you can't say you're a PI without a licence that says so ( like I can't say I'm a doctor without a medical licence), but is this cloing most of the 18 exceptions that have been listed?

Bob

[Richard M Jackson Sr -]

Hi Bob: Trainees will be okay AS LONG AS THEY ARE WORKING WITH SOMEONE WHO IS LICENSED. Trainees will not be able to go out and solicit work for themselves. They can however, work with a licensed attorney and work for them exclusively performing investigations. For the most part, that is where the trainees will have to stay if they don't want to get into trouble.

[Robert A Smith]

Hi Bob: Trainees will be okay AS LONG AS THEY ARE WORKING WITH SOMEONE WHO IS LICENSED. Trainees will not be able to go out and solicit work for themselves. They can however, work with a licensed attorney and work for them exclusively performing investigations. For the most part, that is where the trainees will have to stay if they don't want to get into trouble.

Richard,

That's good. As I understood things, that's the way things were anyway. We get placed with a licenced trainer and can't do things on our own fo rthe most part. Thanks for the clarification! Was worried that now that I'm in the final stages before getting assignments that things were being changed in a bad way for trainees. I've been on that end of things too many times in the past, so was worried history was repeating itself again.

Bob

[Richard M Jackson Sr -]

Sorry Bob! I did not mean to scare you but I am concerned about those who finish their training here with IPIU and believe that at that point, they can call themselves "Private Investigators" in Ohio. They must know that they still must meet the requirements in Ohio for licensing and then get licensed in order to take cases on their own. Anything short of that, is practicing without a license and will land them in jail in Ohio.

[Robert A Smith]

Sorry Bob! I did not mean to scare you but I am concerned about those who finish their training here with IPIU and believe that at that point, they can call themselves "Private Investigators" in Ohio. They must know that they still must meet the requirements in Ohio for licensing and then get licensed in order to take cases on their own. Anything short of that, is practicing without a license and will land them in jail in Ohio.

:D Yes, you scared a bit of life out of me there LOL Thanks for the clarification! I just sent in my test & availability schedule, so I'm getting close to getting assignments now!

Bob

[Scott Bertwell]

I have kind of an odd question. I am a licensed bail bondsman here in the state of Ohio. In the license regulations for PI in this state, it says you can work under an insurance agent's license. Now to my question, being as that the surety bail bond license is defined by the state as an insurance license, could I use that and work under my own license? I've done a few jobs for attorney's thus far, but wondering about this, as some guy wants to hire me for a surveillance job. If i can't do this, he is going to hire me through his attorney, I just didn't want to break any laws, Thank you for any information

[Richard M Jackson Sr -]

Hi Scott:

That portion of the law that allows investigations under an "Insurance" license was meant to allow employees ("Investigators") who work for insurance companies to perform investigations soley for that company. It was not meant to allow them to take on cases for their own benefit. However, an attorney can have any employee of theirs to perform investigations on behalf of the attorney. In addition, the attorney can have someone who is not licensed and hire them ad hoc for a case (not as an employee) and they would be able to perform the investigation(s) legally. Futhermore, as I understand it, OASIS and the state legislators have been working to make all bail bondsmen to come under the P.I.s. Meaning they must have a licensed P.I. either working for them or in charge of them. I can tell you that I currently have a well known bail bonsman company as one of my clients and I find where there people are and the other family member of their people, which allows them to go to the different addresses to retrive their bail jumpers. This is done with access to sophisticated databases accessible to only Licensed P.I.s and Attorneys. Having said that, I do believe that you would be in violation if you do not go through his attorney.

[Richard M Jackson Sr -]

Please forgive the misspelling of "there" where it says "I find where there people are". It should be spelled "their".

[Scott Bertwell]

Ok that is kind of what I was thinking. Exactly why I knew this would be the place to ask the question and get a right answer ;) Thank you for the quick response. He has a child custody case that he is preparing for and that is why he wants to hire me to dig up dirt on her. I will let him know that he will need to contact his attorney and have his attorney contact me. Again thank you for the response :D

[Richard M Jackson Sr -]

You are welcome!! It is my pleasure. I too am involved in handeling a custody case to dig up dirt on the baby's mother. However, in this one. There are two different baby's mothers. The client is so mad at them, he is paying $5,000+ for the dirt. Therefore, happy hunting!!!

[Scott Bertwell]

Wow, that is alot of money for a custody case, but I guess if they want to spend it, it's better for you :D The guy i'm gonna be working for is paying me $500 up front and just paid $60,000 cash on a bond to get out of jail and told a friend of mine, he would make it worth my time if i succeed in the case. However to me right now it's not so much about the money, I want the experience ;)

[Richard M Jackson Sr -]

Wow Scott, $60K to get out of jail? Since the person only has to pay 10% of the cost, his bond must have been $600K. What did he do? I have only seen bonds that high for 2 and 3 time felons. Therfore, be careful regarding your relationship with him. Dont let him get too close to you.

[Scott Bertwell]

He has a $50,000 bond with no 10% allowance, we were hoping to get get 10% so that it would only be $5000 but the judge wouldn't allow it.

Scott

[Tracy L Stephens]

Hello all, maybe someone can clarify this for me. In the state of Ohio can you work for BWC (workers comp) without a license, for the fraud dept? I want to investigate workers comp. fraud. :confused:

[Adam Houchen -]

I also have a question. I have completed a 2 year class in criminal justice through the vocational school. Can any of that time be of use to obtain a PI license in Ohio?
Thanks in advance for any help.
Adam

[Mikel J Burgan -]

Rebecca (and Fellow Ohio Trainees) -

Here's some info you may find helpful:

PI's are now regulated by the Ohio Department of Homeland Security. Information is available at http://www.homelandsecurity.ohio.gov/pisg.htm.

If you are looking to set up a business as a PI, visit the Ohio First Stop Business Connection website at http://www.odod.state.oh.us/onestop/. Follow the instructions to get all the documents you'll need to start the process of building your business. When asked for the type of business, search "Private Investigator" to get the right docs.

(These sites can be accessed from the homepage at http://ohio.gov/.)

A PI trainee is not defined in the statute as far as I can tell, but employees of licensed PI's or PI Corporations are well defined. Furthermore, the statute does not address unlicensed independent contractors. The focus is on licensed PI's and their employees. Having read this, I won't even begin to pretend I understand the extent of the regulations regarding PI trainees and employee status vs. independent contractor. Thus, my questions!

The definition of the business of Private Investigation is broadly written, and the exemptions (in contrast) are narrowly defined. These regulations, by my read, strictly limit the type and scope of work an unlicensed PI can do. The other side of the coin is that you have to have 4000 hours of experience in the two years immediately preceding license application, or an applicable degree and 2000 hours in the preceding year. To get a license, you have to have full-time trainee experience, so obviously unlicensed PI work is allowed under the statute.

How does one go about being an unlicensed trainee when it reads as if a license is just about always required, unless you meet the narrowly defined exemptions? Do you have to be an employee as a trainee or can you be independent? In other words, what exactly are the circumstances that one can gain experience as a PI, without being licensed in Ohio, in order to get licensed in Ohio?

Regarding the required experience, at some point (if you want to be licensed in Ohio) you have to work full-time as a PI trainee. Is there any flexibility in the experience requirement if you are full-time in some other profession not related to law enforcement or investigation and still want to be licensed (for example, getting the hours over a greater number of years)?

Hope the websites help, and thanks for any further info you, or anyone else, may have.

thank you this information has been a great deal of help for me :D

[Theodore Owens]

Having recently gone through the process Mike your quote from Paul hits it square on the head. :)

[Wanda Starner -]

Thanks Technical Support. You cleared things up.
Wanda

[Michelle Adams]

Hi Scott:

That portion of the law that allows investigations under an "Insurance" license was meant to allow employees ("Investigators") who work for insurance companies to perform investigations soley for that company. It was not meant to allow them to take on cases for their own benefit. However, an attorney can have any employee of theirs to perform investigations on behalf of the attorney. In addition, the attorney can have someone who is not licensed and hire them ad hoc for a case (not as an employee) and they would be able to perform the investigation(s) legally. Futhermore, as I understand it, OASIS and the state legislators have been working to make all bail bondsmen to come under the P.I.s. Meaning they must have a licensed P.I. either working for them or in charge of them. I can tell you that I currently have a well known bail bonsman company as one of my clients and I find where there people are and the other family member of their people, which allows them to go to the different addresses to retrive their bail jumpers. This is done with access to sophisticated databases accessible to only Licensed P.I.s and Attorneys. Having said that, I do believe that you would be in violation if you do not go through his attorney.

Richard, In the State of Ohio can you work for an licensed agency and an attorney at the same time? Or can you only work for one person or agency at a time? I keep getting all these offers and don't know what to tell them? I currently work for a agency as a trainee, and I do not have my license yet. I have also done some research for a licensed PI out of state, but did not accept any payment for it. It was just your basic public records search. I just marked it up as experience and a learning tool. Do you think I can use those hours to send to the State of Ohio as credits? I would also like to take a few more classes, but there are no local schools available in my area for this industry. All they offer is criminal justice. Big deal! So how does one gain the knowledge, credits or experience. The only way I can think of is on the job experience.

Any tips from anyone are greatly appreciated. And good luck to all of those whom are new members.

[Cynthia Ford]

can you work for an licensed agency and an attorney at the same time?
Answer: Yes, if both firms are based in Ohio. Otherwise, out of state firms may require you to be licensed in your name, depending on the types of assignments. This is left up to the agency or the attorney when you apply.


can you only work for one person or agency at a time?
It depends on the types of cases. For regulated cases, an unlicensed employee can work for more than one licensed Ohio firm. And unlicensed independent contractor should only perform unregulated cases, which are the Ohio Exemptions to licensing, such as Intergrity Cases (or mystery shopping), auditing, courthouse retrievals, background checks, etc.


I keep getting all these offers and don't know what to tell them? Just follow their suggestions after you provide them with your unlicensed status. They know their business.


I currently work for a agency as a trainee, and I do not have my license yet. That is good and within the law.



I have also done some research for a licensed PI out of state, but did not accept any payment for it. It was just your basic public records search. I just marked it up as experience and a learning tool. You could have charged for that case because "research" is an unregulated assignment that does not require a PI License. Again, read the Exemptions.



Do you think I can use those hours to send to the State of Ohio as credits? By itself, no. But yes, document all of your assignments, bith regulated under another license, and unregulated "research, etc" because when it is all added up, the board of licensing can make that decision to count your entire record as long as it is documented fully.



I would also like to take a few more classes, but there are no local schools available in my area for this industry. All they offer is criminal justice. Big deal! So how does one gain the knowledge, credits or experience. The only way I can think of is on the job experience.


When you obtain your Level 4 access, there are over 150 agency and firms that can both use you as well as provide you with experience.

Advance Education is available at the following IPIU Bookstore:
http://www.privateinvestigators.cc/index.php?cPath=21

As mentioned, Bail Enforcement and Private Investigations are very close. You may wish to consider the Bail Enforcement Advanced Studies, which includes examination and academic certification:

COMPLETE BOUNTY HUNTER KIT (http://www.privateinvestigators.cc/product_info.php?products_id=992)

Sincerely,

Cynthia


<hr>

Comments are not intended to be and should absolutely not be taken as legal advice and you should not act and should refrain from acting based, in whole or in part, on suggested comments. If needed, please consult an attorney in your area for specific laws related to the issue at hand.

[Mary F Burnell -]

Is membership in IPIU going to provide any "up" to obtaining membership in OASIS?
I read the licensing rules regarding licensing in Ohio and seeing that a Ohio PI license now costs $375 - my heart sank!
It seems reasonable to pay the IPIU membership for what is provided and offered. However, now that I see I also would be faced with a $375 payment to become licensed, I begin second guessing myself on how it will be feasible for me as I move along this path.
Can you shed some light on this?


Hello, I am somewhat new to these forums. However, as a Licensed Ohio Private Investigator, I am compelled to bring everyone up to date on this issue. As September 4, 2004, ALL Private Investigators and Security Guard Providers are under the umbrella of the Ohio Department of Public Safety through the Office of Homeland Security. Having said that, there are a number of changes taking affect to the laws of licensing of each. Now, I have read some of the post in this forum talking about doing work for private clients that fall outside the realm of the current law. THAT IS BEING CHANGED!!! No longer will businesses and individuals be able to perform this work without being licensed. I for one, totaly agree with this. As a member of OASIS, which is the reconized professional organization of private investigators and security gaurd providers in the state of Ohio, a close watch will be placed in the industry to seek out and prosecute those who are practicing investigations without a license. Currently, the Director of Homeland Security has prosecuted 6 individuals within the last few weeks for such a thing and he states he will keep doing so until EVERYONE knows that you MUST HAVE A LICENSE TO PRACTICE INVESTIGATIONS IN OHIO, with only a few of the 18 exceptions that you saw listed above.

The exceptions that most likely will remain will be "engaged in the practice of law" or working for someone who is. It is still a toss up regarding "Independent Insurance Adjusters". However, "Process Servers" and "Background Checks" will more than likely be gone within the next year or so. The jury is still out on the others. Basicly, just as the attorneys have the lock down on the practice of law, investigators are starting to do the same. Also, the Director of Homeland Security has hired investigators to work for his office in each of the 88 counties in Ohio to investigate any and all companies currently practicing "Process Serving and Background Checks" to advise them of the need to get licensed within the next year or so. He is also letting them know that if they don't, they will be prosecuted.

[Mary F Burnell -]

This has been extremely educational ...
Knowing the Ohio PI licensing fee is $375 was an awakening for me.
Thanks for all the information shared here.



Sorry Bob! I did not mean to scare you but I am concerned about those who finish their training here with IPIU and believe that at that point, they can call themselves "Private Investigators" in Ohio. They must know that they still must meet the requirements in Ohio for licensing and then get licensed in order to take cases on their own. Anything short of that, is practicing without a license and will land them in jail in Ohio.

[Robert Buchanan]

I have a question regarding the experience requirement in Ohio. What is considered acceptable experience? Would my four years of retail investigation experience relevant?

I also have a question regarding insurance investigations and licensing. Would someone need to have a private investigator license to do insurance surveillance in Ohio if the company is located in a different state?

Thank you for any input you may have.

[Theodore Owens]

I have a question regarding the experience requirement in Ohio. What is considered acceptable experience? Would my four years of retail investigation experience relevant?

I also have a question regarding insurance investigations and licensing. Would someone need to have a private investigator license to do insurance surveillance in Ohio if the company is located in a different state?

Thank you for any input you may have.


I would say that it meets the requirement(s). However, maybe you might want to run that question by Ohio DPS PI/SG section. Below is their website:

http://www.homelandsecurity.ohio.gov/hls.asp

Or you can try to call them at 614-466-4130.

Hope that gets you to the right place.

[Constance Stacy -]

Thank you for this information, I just moved back to Ohio and this will help greatly.

[Marko Samson -]

I thought the license that IPIU gave out were for trainees and that you were supposed to use this as a stepping stone to getting your license in whatever state you lived by filling out your resume's and handing them into private investigative company's as a trainee. Am I getting this right or not. Isn't IPIU supposed to get your foot in the door by letting you say that you are part of the union.

[Connie Pelow]

Thank you ,the information was invaluable.

[Michael Harris]

Thanks for the information. I may be relocating from the wonderful Jersey Pine Barrens to Cincinnati, OH.

At least the laws in Ohio make some sense.

[Stormy Renner -]

:D OK - I've read this before and thought that I could not take the test until I had 2000 hours of investigative work in. I also thought that I was not included in the exemptions by what I do in my current job.

HOWEVER, by reading this over again more closely, I believe that I am one of the exemptions and CAN take the test now. I am a licensed P&C insurance agent and have well over the required number of hours since I've been working there for close to 7 years!! I am going to call on Monday just to make sure and hopefully set up a date to take that puppy! :D

Now watch, since I am all pumped up about it....they will say I can't. My luck.

[Stormy Renner -]

Good news,
I am being sent an application and after I send it in along with the electronic fringerprinting - I'll be given a date and time to take the test. I am going to be going over everything and making sure I am ready. :D

[Michael Harris]

:D OK - I've read this before and thought that I could not take the test until I had 2000 hours of investigative work in. I also thought that I was not included in the exemptions by what I do in my current job.

HOWEVER, by reading this over again more closely, I believe that I am one of the exemptions and CAN take the test now. ...

Stormy,

I see by the popst after this one that they sent you an application. GREAT!

I think you stressed one of the key features in the business - "... reading ... over again more closely,".

You will ace the test.

[DJ Moran]

Good news,
I am being sent an application and after I send it in along with the electronic fringerprinting - I'll be given a date and time to take the test. I am going to be going over everything and making sure I am ready. :D

Stormy,

The news is GREAT! :D

Good Luck to you!;)

[Diana Fleischman]

As a Private Investigator Trainee (independent contractor) while contracting off and on to ie: Attorneys or Law Enforcement Agencies or Insurance Co. I understand we don't need a license however; if we would like to contract as a trainee on the Internet (only) must we be licensed? I understand some States do not require a license ie: Co however; I understand that the Colorado Gold Program is excellent.

[Jason Crouch -]

Diana Post # 1 is very informative for your question 1 alternative I have found is to go ahead and get my Insurance Series 6 and 60 and apply with a insurance company as a insurance adjuster I have already taken multiple Insurance continuing Education courses but they will not apply till I get licensed in Insurance I am going to use my Integrity Investigation and Other cases that I have performed as my Investigative Experience I am also going to include investigating experience that I perform from my employer for the past 2 years I personally think this can prove to be a very promising route to my personal venture I would also recomend you look at Colorado Gold program it is also very infomative I have signed up and they have very helpful

[Chad Hodkinson -]

WOW!! this is definatly a lot of good info.

[Michelle Adams]

Has anyone heard or have an update on Ohio Licensing?
Even after you read the requirements on Homeland Security - it's so confusing!!

[Petra Post]

Has anyone heard or have an update on Ohio Licensing?
Even after you read the requirements on Homeland Security - it's so confusing!!
Michelle,

I know exactly how you feel, lol. I always say, if I was to understand the 'written' laws better, I would be a lawyer, lol.

I guess, the most important part is that you understand, there are exemptions. Meaning, you don't need to be licensed to complete those. If you fall into any of the above mentioned categories, you can do the job. The ultimate... get a license. Until you do, I would get any job that is offered to you (after applying), no matter how small, to get experience.

I hope this helped you for now. I am sure, someone else will drop in on you that is able to explain it better:)

[Theodore Owens]

Michelle,

Contact me offline. Google my name or company name. I can explain the procedures for licensing in Ohio better or answer any questions you may have.

Ted:cool:

[Michelle Adams]

Thank you for the information. I have already worked with an agency and have various experience. I have earn several hundred hours over the years, but still short. I still need to complete my test here and update my ID. Then I will continue my journey.

I have called Homeland Security here in Ohio, but get conflicting information from their office. So I was hoping someone here who has a license could explain it.

Thank you all for your responses and info. I "Think" I have all of my questions answered.

Highest regards & thanks again!

PS My goal? My license!!! ;)

[Michael Harris]

Michelle,

Having been in the defense business for almost four decades, I have seen a few good federal government offices and lots of bad ones. I thought nothing could get any worse than Dept of Energy when they were formed--mistake. Dept of Homeland Security scares me almost as much as Obama does. Homeland Security is so mismanaged.

[Technical Support - USA]

Has anyone heard or have an update on Ohio Licensing?Yes, I have ADDED the new resources and home page to Post #1 of this topic. Please go to the following link and review the changes and the three new links under NEW RESOURCES:

http://www.ipiu.org/forums/showthread.php?p=14426#post14426

Even after you read the requirements on Homeland Security - it's so confusing!!Please post whatever items you need clarification on. We are here to help, but the help must be in writing so as to give you a resource to rely on.

TIP: Never speak to anyone at any licensing department about state law. Verbal assurances do not stand up to written law. Everyone has an opinion, but you should rely on statutes.

[Michelle Adams]

I agree - Thank you so very much
Regards from Ohio

[Jason Hoffman]

ok interested i becoming a PI.how do i get licenced.as i understand it i must have around 2 years experience.if i go to school for say an associates in criminal justice would that count as experiance at all.is there any schooling to count for experiance.also how do you get experiance in a field u have none in.what are the requirements to work for say a law firm as a private I.how do u get started in the bussines at an entry level.also if anyone would happen to know of any firms or businesses that might be looking for enry level or apprentice.also are there apprentice programs and where might i find info on them.wow lots of questions sorry.any help would be appreciated:D:D

[Petra Post]

ok interested i becoming a PI.how do i get licenced.as i understand it i must have around 2 years experience.if i go to school for say an associates in criminal justice would that count as experiance at all.is there any schooling to count for experiance.also how do you get experiance in a field u have none in.what are the requirements to work for say a law firm as a private I.how do u get started in the bussines at an entry level.also if anyone would happen to know of any firms or businesses that might be looking for enry level or apprentice.also are there apprentice programs and where might i find info on them.wow lots of questions sorry.any help would be appreciated:D:D
Jason,

Start by authoring yourself an introduction topic in the Forum Member Introduction Lounge. Other members will come by there to welcome you properly and give you links to look at then:) Once you've browsed the forums a bit, you will find your answers... and if not, your intro will be the place to ask.

I'll see you in your intro:) Take care.

[Jennifer Smith]

As an Ohio licensed PI, I can absolutely say YOU WILL have more job opportunities!! And better pay. However, be careful that you understand the OH laws for PI's. Firstly, you must have 4000 hours to hold your own license or two years experience in law enforcement or military, or a sponsor (you'll also hear this referred to as an Employer when you talk to certain people in the HSODS licensing office). The licensing division of the Ohio Dept. of Safety website has all the information you need, but don't hesitate to call them for a one on one for any questions.

Sub contracting jobs DO NOT count toward you're hours. Ohio frowns on your working for any agency that does not have you on payroll (pays your taxes, Soc. Sec., etc.). You can work for and be licensed under as many agencies as you want.

Religiously check IPIU's job boards and threads for job opportunities. If you are wanting to perform surveillance or perform SIU or Interviews for legal purposes YOU MUST HAVE A LICENSE. The same if you want to solicit your own accounts.

Another great benefit to getting licensed through and agency as a trainee or employee is that if your agency carries all the liability so will only offer you work you can legal do while your clocking your hours and gaining experience. My employer even paid not only for my OH license but my PA license too! And I get steady work in other states too that allow PI's to work on those licenses by reciperocity.

Final thought- It's your call on wheather to get licensed or not, but I urge you not to jeapordize your future opportunities and income (reputation and quality of work are EVERYTHING in this business!) for a quick buck. It does take time to get established and earn your chops but it's worth it. Get the facts, ask questions, and don't be afraid to call the licensing division or more experienced PI's in OH. I've been doing this for about 2 and half years, and last year I broke 50K, so far this year I'm on course to earn closer to 100K.

Be safe, be legal, and be profitable!!
Jenn Smith

[Ginger Griswold]

Do you really need security Guard state license if you already have P.I.license? And are there a site or a list of jobs available for P.I.work in Ohio or a list of homeland security guard jobs in Ohio, how do u apply and get applications in order to apply for these jobs in Ohio

[Diana Fleischman]

Hello Jenn,

I just finished reading your thread above and I have a question. You mentioned if you have at least 2 years of experience in law enforcement or the military you may get your P.I. license is that correct? please would you explain how to do this if I understand this to be correct?

Thanks,

Diana Fleischman

[Ginger Griswold]

I askes if a person has to have a P.I. license to do homeland security work and does anyone know of anyone here in ohio that is hiring for p.i. work or homeland security work and how would I apply for those jobs or seek a application, thanks, Gin

[Tim Merklinger]

Originally posted by Jason Pelaez on 02-06-10:

"I am wondering if I meet the minimal criteria to apply to for my Ohio Private Investigator license. I have been a claims adjuster for my Insurance company for over two years. My first year, I was the classic claims adjuster for my city. I was then offered a Sr. Level Multi State Claims Represenative position. In this position, I currently investigate coverage, liability, and look for fraud indicators for investigation on in the claim. I am also a fourth year student from Kaplan University in the field of Criminal Justice with an emphasis in Fraud and Investigation."

[Tim Merklinger]

Originally posted by Jennifer Smith on 02-07-10:

"ODS-HLS does not list claims adjuster as a qualified exemption such as Military and Police. But I will say in my experience of working with them to obtain my license (still working on it!! Don't expect it to be processed in a couple of weeks!) they are VERY willing to answer any questions, and are very easy to reach call 614-451-4637, that is the direct number for the licensing division. Having a criminal justice degree is a great asset for job hunting, but really doesn't come in to play with licensing. I highly encouarge getting the degree, but it is also EXCEPTIONALLY important to get the OJT you will only get in the field. ODS-HLS usually requires your hours to be as a licensed PI under employment of a State Licensed (any state) agency for 4000 hours over a 2 year period. If you find you don't meet the requirements with ODS-HLS with your current job history, try getting your agency license in a less stringently regulated state (PA is easy, but very confusing to get to who you need to deal with, there is a different person per county and one overall civilian that records everything) and then apply for your Ohio License as an out of state or branch office license. Ohio is a great state to get licensed in, and I have found most states will basically grant you license in their state with just the submission of the fee and application if you are licensed in Ohio. But be patient, it is a government process.

Best of luck! Keep us posted on your progress."

[Tim Merklinger]

Originally posted by Jennifer Smith on 02-07-10:

"Originally Posted by Diana Fleischman View Post
Hello Jenn,

I just finished reading your thread above and I have a question. You mentioned if you have at least 2 years of experience in law enforcement or the military you may get your P.I. license is that correct? please would you explain how to do this if I understand this to be correct?

Thanks,

Diana Fleischman

Diana,

So sorry to take so long to get to answering this, I've been slammed with work- which is great!! To answer your question, YES- if you are/were in the Military or Law Enforcement (actively, not as a civilian employee) you do not have to meet the hours requirement to apply. EVERYONE must complete an application (go to http://homelandsecurity.ohio.gov/ohs_pisg.stm for ALL forms and instructions), have your fingerprints/BCI background completed (links are available from the previous site as well), supply 5 character reference letters, a copy of your Insurane binder, and supply a 2x2 pic. If you are applying based on your military or law enforcement background you will need to provide proof, just as if you are applying based on hours you need to provided all companies and contact info to verify.

Best of luck!
Jenn"

[Tim Merklinger]

Originally posted by Jennifer Smith on 02-07-10:


"Originally Posted by Ginger Griswold View Post
I askes if a person has to have a P.I. license to do homeland security work and does anyone know of anyone here in ohio that is hiring for p.i. work or homeland security work and how would I apply for those jobs or seek a application, thanks, Gin
Ginger,

Firstly keep hitting the IPIU job boards!! That's where I got my start and it's invaluable! There are TONS of forums for PI's but cruising the IPIU forums and learning from your fellow members is really the greatest way to get the juices flowing and get creative about where to look, and you'll hear from others where NOT to look! If you have a PI or PI Trainee resume distribute it to local attorney's and post it on EVERY free site possible! If you don't have one- GET ONE!

Best of luck,
Jenn"

[Tina Frank]

Hello everyone. I do have some questions regarding qualified experience to obtain your PI license in Ohio.

I have 7 years of correction officer experience, and have done some integrity investigations and also some assignments for RQA.

I am in my second year to obtain my bachelors in Criminal Justice.

Would this constitute qualified hours to obtain my license?

It is so hard to get any type of experience in my area as a trainee.

Also have the same question as Tracy, do you have to have a license to work for the BWC?

Thank you for any information you can provide.

[Theodore Owens]

Hi Tina,

The ones that can really best answer your questions is the PI/SG section of Ohio Department of Homeland Security in Columbus. My LEO experience qualified me for my license.

Next, BWC has their own SIU section for their fraud investigations. Currently they have not "privatized" their investigations.

If you need more info feel free to contact me offline at my company.

[Tina Frank]

Thank you Theodore. I really appreciate that information.

It's funny because every investigator job I have applied for states you must have some type of experience. How do you get that experience if they all want experience?! LOL.

And I look everywhere, believe me. I get daily emails from Indeed, Jacob Peebles, Get Investigator Jobs all of them.

Thank you again for this information, very helpful to me.

Tina Frank

[Robert Donovan]

Potential changes to the Ohio PI Statutes:

http://www.homelandsecurity.ohio.gov/ORC4749Revisions_05-12-10.pdf

Not yet approved, but they are thinking about it.